Impulsive Disobedience and Self-Denial

[aw****]

I am compelled to emphasize that I am a sub-switch with warring impulses to dominate/control and do not enjoy degrading or doll/slave experiences.
.

Beyond the highlighted, I enjoy being handled. Roughed around, taken, spanked, tied, ***d, explored, demanded, and often a firm reminder to listen and obey. I wouldn't call my experiences "sessions" as I feel like it is best understood as a total experience, nearing 24/7 mindset. More degrees and fluctuations that edge the appropriate and my mental barriers.
.

As for my mental barriers, at times I feel like I need so much reassurance and praise and gentle attention that it is confusing. My mind will degrade itself, spiral, and plummet into chaotic negativity. Trust, clarity, and desire start to erode. I haven't found a strict pattern, but it's definitely related to attention, reassurance, praise, and maybe my energy.
.

Big topics that I get lost in analyzing, often in real time, are if I'm being a good sub, if I'm worthy, my appearance, what to say, how to respond physically or mentally, even questions of enjoyment and pleasure. It can get quite intense at times. What ends up happening is I'll disobey purposefully, tiptoe the line for a big reaction, want to flee, or go numb. Basically self-denial.
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What is most awful is that during this time I'll still be randomly consumed by wanting, still have a high libido, highly imagine scenarios and masterbate just as often, and yet incredibly sexually frustrated and mentally blocked from enjoyment or fulfillment. My sexual desire is so strong and yet it's crushed by some engulfing oppression and overwhelming desire for autonomy.
.

Does anyone else experience this? What has helped? What calms it, keeps it at bay, or restores that willingness to obey? Do any Doms have experience with this in their sub? I'm also willing to hear from masters, owners, and strict dynamic holders, too.
.

Thank you 🥺

Edited October 21 by awsmx3rain

[Mo****]

I had a sub person has similar mixed feelings and different phases ! It took a while to understand what I called phases ! To know when it's the time to be her friend- when to be her dom ! And when to be just to be the mixed ' it's the mental status needs and we all have different moods and needs - ! It's all about you letting yourself and open to let someone in- start to trust them step by step ! Allowing them to see what you have and how you feel and think ' sharing and transparency, honesty and direct is what you will get you to your unclear goal

[aw****]

10 minutes ago, Motyaze said:

I had a sub person has similar mixed feelings and different phases ! It took a while to understand what I called phases ! To know when it's the time to be her friend- when to be her dom ! And when to be just to be the mixed ' it's the mental status needs and we all have different moods and needs - ! It's all about you letting yourself and open to let someone in- start to trust them step by step ! Allowing them to see what you have and how you feel and think ' sharing and transparency, honesty and direct is what you will get you to your unclear goal

Is it mixed feelings? Hm. Complexities dissolve as trust increases? The let and allow are hard to exhibit in these moments, regardless of the honesty and transparency. In the moment these thoughts and feelings are not always comprehended or known. It's after reflection, mostly.

[Ed****]

I’ll be honest, I experience something similar, yet slightly different almost constantly.

For me, I am ALWAYS yearning for that deep, controlling dynamic that gives me certain expectations and outlets for those expectations. But for me, it’s almost the opposite. Instead of becoming intentionally disobedient, I become hyper obedient; bordering on obsessive and fanatical towards the dom that I have. It’s uncontrollable, these sudden bouts of hyperactive neediness. They leave me with a hollow feeling in my chest, the deepest desire for being held and touched, and most of all for being murmured to lovingly about my worth and being constantly praised.

It’s so difficult, because I value my own autonomy and the autonomy of others with an even stronger level of will than the other desires. It’s unthinkable for me to change my daily habits for a dom, or to make someone else change theirs, but all the while I NEED the structure and constants of that relationship. I’m so independent, yet am crushed intensively by the hollowness in my heart. It’s confusing and exhausting. Especially since so much of it is always intertwined with my individuality, wanting a level of comfort and submission, yet not wanting it or tolerating it past a certain point.

I don’t know if it’s anything like what you feel, but I just knew I had to say something on this post because no one has ever expressed something this close to my feelings internally before. If you wanna talk more, you can DM me, but otherwise I hope this helps in some way.

[aw****]

14 minutes ago, Edgylorde said:

I’ll be honest, I experience something similar, yet slightly different almost constantly.

For me, I am ALWAYS yearning for that deep, controlling dynamic that gives me certain expectations and outlets for those expectations. But for me, it’s almost the opposite. Instead of becoming intentionally disobedient, I become hyper obedient; bordering on obsessive and fanatical towards the dom that I have. It’s uncontrollable, these sudden bouts of hyperactive neediness. They leave me with a hollow feeling in my chest, the deepest desire for being held and touched, and most of all for being murmured to lovingly about my worth and being constantly praised.

It’s so difficult, because I value my own autonomy and the autonomy of others with an even stronger level of will than the other desires. It’s unthinkable for me to change my daily habits for a dom, or to make someone else change theirs, but all the while I NEED the structure and constants of that relationship. I’m so independent, yet am crushed intensively by the hollowness in my heart. It’s confusing and exhausting. Especially since so much of it is always intertwined with my individuality, wanting a level of comfort and submission, yet not wanting it or tolerating it past a certain point.

I don’t know if it’s anything like what you feel, but I just knew I had to say something on this post because no one has ever expressed something this close to my feelings internally before. If you wanna talk more, you can DM me, but otherwise I hope this helps in some way.

Oh man. Maybe that is another way to describe it?

I am also hyper independent and stroke my ego with the achievement of my triumphs. Then there is a yearning to give myself to another. To be directed, structured, that crave for consistency in demands.

Is it a toleration dance?

[an****]

Is it more of chasing the 'high' of more autonomy so you have more to surrender when you switch?

Does the pendulum only feel euphoric at the moments between falls as it pauses at the extremes?

Shame avoidance kink? Shame of being in control? Shame of being submissive?

Wanting balance but not being comfortable with tolerating balance?

[lostInSwizzerland]

I wonder if what you’re describing is less a struggle between submission and dominance, and more a struggle between surrender and vulnerability.

You can crave being handled, challenged, and pushed to your limits, while another part of you refuses to surrender the moment submission starts feeling like a test you might fail. So you provoke, disobey, or pull away — not necessarily because you want less control from your Dom, but because you need to know whether the connection can withstand the parts of you that are difficult to manage.

That distinction matters.

A good Dom doesn’t mistake every act of disobedience for an invitation to tighten the leash. Sometimes the strongest response is firmness. Sometimes it’s patience. And sometimes it’s recognizing that what looks like defiance is someone fighting a battle inside their own head.

I believe in authority, structure, and consequences when they’re understood and consensual. But real control isn’t about making someone incapable of resisting you. It’s about building enough trust that they no longer feel they have to fight themselves just to feel safe in surrender.

Perhaps the question isn’t how to make yourself obey again. Perhaps it’s what happens inside you when obedience stops feeling like a choice and starts feeling like a judgment of your worth.

You don’t have to earn the right to be cared for by being a perfect sub.

And I’d be curious to know one thing: when you deliberately disobey and provoke a reaction, what are you secretly hoping your Dom will prove to you in that moment?

[aw****]

9 hours ago, anotherusername said:

Is it more of chasing the 'high' of more autonomy so you have more to surrender when you switch?

Does the pendulum only feel euphoric at the moments between falls as it pauses at the extremes?

Shame avoidance kink? Shame of being in control? Shame of being submissive?

Wanting balance but not being comfortable with tolerating balance?

Ooof. Such great questions. So much to unpack.

For me I don't feel it's shame. It's definitely a different emotion.

Chasing, may be a good choice for an action word, perhaps the release, the decision to submit, the allowance of trust.

Definitely would say it is also tied to tolerance.

Trust and tolerance. Consistency and the recognition of achievements. Hm...

[aw****]

3 hours ago, lostInSwizzerland said:

I wonder if what you’re describing is less a struggle between submission and dominance, and more a struggle between surrender and vulnerability.

You can crave being handled, challenged, and pushed to your limits, while another part of you refuses to surrender the moment submission starts feeling like a test you might fail. So you provoke, disobey, or pull away — not necessarily because you want less control from your Dom, but because you need to know whether the connection can withstand the parts of you that are difficult to manage.

That distinction matters.

A good Dom doesn’t mistake every act of disobedience for an invitation to tighten the leash. Sometimes the strongest response is firmness. Sometimes it’s patience. And sometimes it’s recognizing that what looks like defiance is someone fighting a battle inside their own head.

I believe in authority, structure, and consequences when they’re understood and consensual. But real control isn’t about making someone incapable of resisting you. It’s about building enough trust that they no longer feel they have to fight themselves just to feel safe in surrender.

Perhaps the question isn’t how to make yourself obey again. Perhaps it’s what happens inside you when obedience stops feeling like a choice and starts feeling like a judgment of your worth.

You don’t have to earn the right to be cared for by being a perfect sub.

And I’d be curious to know one thing: when you deliberately disobey and provoke a reaction, what are you secretly hoping your Dom will prove to you in that moment?

Oh. My.

Beautifully written. I'll read this and digest it for a worthy response.

[lostInSwizzerland]

10 minuti fa, awsmx3rain said:

Oh. My.

Beautifully written. I'll read this and digest it for a worthy response.

Good. I prefer a woman who takes her time over one who rushes to give the expected answer. Some things are more interesting when they’re allowed to unfold naturally. 😉

[an****]

55 minutes ago, awsmx3rain said:

Ooof. Such great questions. So much to unpack.

For me I don't feel it's shame. It's definitely a different emotion.

Chasing, may be a good choice for an action word, perhaps the release, the decision to submit, the allowance of trust.

Definitely would say it is also tied to tolerance.

Trust and tolerance. Consistency and the recognition of achievements. Hm...

So, I've been mulling this over all day. Not sure if this has any applications but it is interesting 🤔

Some of what you said made me think of how a person who experienced a hard upbringing, (very strict, like prison rules).

Except maybe for this person following rules was never a negative, but they learned after adulthood to see this strict upbringing as a negative and were thrust into hyper independence or acting out or something.

When in fact they actually liked the submission and rules only to find themselves in this rinse/repeat cycle of avoiding the problem and the solution, because the solution is also the problem.

And a step further, they liked how much autonomy was stripped away because they didn't have control of their actions or anything.

The problem with this last one is that a person like this could never get back to that state of zero autonomy from their parents unless they were jailed.

When did this start or when you first noticed?

[an****]

One more thing, you said you do not enjoy degrading/slave is this a significant trigger or just something you can take/leave but do not prefer/like?

[aw****]

16 hours ago, lostInSwizzerland said:

I wonder if what you’re describing is less a struggle between submission and dominance, and more a struggle between surrender and vulnerability.

You can crave being handled, challenged, and pushed to your limits, while another part of you refuses to surrender the moment submission starts feeling like a test you might fail. So you provoke, disobey, or pull away — not necessarily because you want less control from your Dom, but because you need to know whether the connection can withstand the parts of you that are difficult to manage.

That distinction matters.

A good Dom doesn’t mistake every act of disobedience for an invitation to tighten the leash. Sometimes the strongest response is firmness. Sometimes it’s patience. And sometimes it’s recognizing that what looks like defiance is someone fighting a battle inside their own head.

I believe in authority, structure, and consequences when they’re understood and consensual. But real control isn’t about making someone incapable of resisting you. It’s about building enough trust that they no longer feel they have to fight themselves just to feel safe in surrender.

Perhaps the question isn’t how to make yourself obey again. Perhaps it’s what happens inside you when obedience stops feeling like a choice and starts feeling like a judgment of your worth.

You don’t have to earn the right to be cared for by being a perfect sub.

And I’d be curious to know one thing: when you deliberately disobey and provoke a reaction, what are you secretly hoping your Dom will prove to you in that moment?

Okay. Surrender and vulnerability. Hm. Let's dive.

You mention a *** of failure, or a *** of losing the connection. Is it a test one senses and projects upon their Dom? *** leads to a lack of vulnerability and Aman inability to surrender, so projection is initiated and testing boundaries/provoking/brat behavior is the result?

A good Dom is responsive and fluid with their behavior based on the recognition of their sub's struggle to surrender. I'd enjoy that fantasy.

Runs back to toleration, trust, recognition, and consistency.

I suppose that inward look in the moments of the shift in vulnerability would be the best insight. I wonder how to even have the capacity to recognize, cognitively analyze, and reflect in real time. Usually flight or flight mode gets activated and dulls my sensory system awareness. Reflection after often is a hit or miss due to life challenges. It can leave a defeated feeling rather than explorative. Maybe there should be some intention embedded to the act. But then authenticity gets questioned.

Secretly hoping? Probably filthy things one moment and pure tyranny *** another. 🫠

[aw****]

12 hours ago, anotherusername said:

So, I've been mulling this over all day. Not sure if this has any applications but it is interesting 🤔

Some of what you said made me think of how a person who experienced a hard upbringing, (very strict, like prison rules).

Except maybe for this person following rules was never a negative, but they learned after adulthood to see this strict upbringing as a negative and were thrust into hyper independence or acting out or something.

When in fact they actually liked the submission and rules only to find themselves in this rinse/repeat cycle of avoiding the problem and the solution, because the solution is also the problem.

And a step further, they liked how much autonomy was stripped away because they didn't have control of their actions or anything.

The problem with this last one is that a person like this could never get back to that state of zero autonomy from their parents unless they were jailed.

When did this start or when you first noticed?

Environmental upbringing approach to subject, hm?

Maybe. I enjoy patterns, rules, and strict guidelines. Structured spontaneity. 😅 Just send emme a photo of the restraints you're thinking about so I have an idea of the tolerance allowance needed to experience it with maximum pleasure capacity.🤭

When did it start? I've been a sub-switch brat and provoker my entire life. It's a literal lifestyle. 😅

It's a fun personality to experience though! For those who like challenges and have thick skin. 😉

[an****]

Interesting 🤔 (also I absolutely adore your use of emojis 🤗)

This is a very normal dom conflict for your switch side, people just don't have your capacity to understand this is what is happening nor articulate it so well. You said self-denial. Maybe 'sub-denial'?

Can you examine the difference between your wanting control and your wanting to controlling the release of control. I.e. know all the possibilities and actions to avoid surprise. (Very analytical, high intelligence 🤓)

Conflict: both are control

You mentioned that you get frustrated and 'act out'. Sounds different than the fun brat lifestyle you say with a silly emoji 😅.

Sounds like a good next branch to investigate.

I truly do not know, so I ask this: Are you getting upset by the way the dynamic is or is not following the 'pattern' (you have in your head/research), then breaking the pattern (by acting out) to create unknown submission opportunities and uncertainty?

Have you tried a scene with zero information, high uncertainty? Sense/knowledge deprivation? Total submission of the scene and of knowledge about the scene.

How does that feel?

How does the thought of being in a ***ed scene feel (as a reference to extreme loss of autonomy).

[lostInSwizzerland]

5 ore fa, awsmx3rain said:

Okay. Surrender and vulnerability. Hm. Let's dive.

You mention a *** of failure, or a *** of losing the connection. Is it a test one senses and projects upon their Dom? *** leads to a lack of vulnerability and Aman inability to surrender, so projection is initiated and testing boundaries/provoking/brat behavior is the result?

A good Dom is responsive and fluid with their behavior based on the recognition of their sub's struggle to surrender. I'd enjoy that fantasy.

Runs back to toleration, trust, recognition, and consistency.

I suppose that inward look in the moments of the shift in vulnerability would be the best insight. I wonder how to even have the capacity to recognize, cognitively analyze, and reflect in real time. Usually flight or flight mode gets activated and dulls my sensory system awareness. Reflection after often is a hit or miss due to life challenges. It can leave a defeated feeling rather than explorative. Maybe there should be some intention embedded to the act. But then authenticity gets questioned.

Secretly hoping? Probably filthy things one moment and pure tyranny *** another. 🫠

Perhaps authenticity isn’t the absence of intention. Perhaps it’s what remains when you stop trying to control the outcome.

You don’t necessarily need to understand every reaction while it’s happening. Sometimes the more interesting question is whether you feel safe enough to look at it afterward without turning it into another reason to judge yourself.

And as for your little contradiction between filthy desires and pure tyranny… I suspect those two aren’t nearly as far apart as you’d like to believe. 😉

The interesting part isn’t how far someone can push you. It’s discovering what happens when you meet someone who knows when to push, when to wait, and when not to let you hide behind the provocation.

But I have a feeling you already know that.

You just haven’t decided what to do with it yet.
🖤

[aw****]

5 hours ago, anotherusername said:

Interesting 🤔 (also I absolutely adore your use of emojis 🤗)

This is a very normal dom conflict for your switch side, people just don't have your capacity to understand this is what is happening nor articulate it so well. You said self-denial. Maybe 'sub-denial'?

Can you examine the difference between your wanting control and your wanting to controlling the release of control. I.e. know all the possibilities and actions to avoid surprise. (Very analytical, high intelligence 🤓)

Conflict: both are control

You mentioned that you get frustrated and 'act out'. Sounds different than the fun brat lifestyle you say with a silly emoji 😅.

Sounds like a good next branch to investigate.

I truly do not know, so I ask this: Are you getting upset by the way the dynamic is or is not following the 'pattern' (you have in your head/research), then breaking the pattern (by acting out) to create unknown submission opportunities and uncertainty?

Have you tried a scene with zero information, high uncertainty? Sense/knowledge deprivation? Total submission of the scene and of knowledge about the scene.

How does that feel?

How does the thought of being in a ***ed scene feel (as a reference to extreme loss of autonomy).

Ha. I think the Dom/sub-switch conflict gets reduced to "brat" but I'm not sure as I really have little evidence for that opinion.

The desire to know all the possibilities sometimes turns into anxiety or infuriates doms. "why all these questions?" "You'll see" " be a good girl." It's very low support. 🫠 The examination is meaningless when control is the root. Then it becomes a power struggle. And my brat says....hold steady.

Frustration leads to "acting out" of sub mindset...build obedience? Never me. Reassurance and consistency? Leads to sub possibilities. Because I would rather sit in enjoyment and pleasure than sadness and confusion, I'll just create my own enjoyment. 🤷🏽‍♀️ Again, brat mode.

Any deviation from the norm is discerning to me and causes anxiety. But when the pattern of the dynamic is the Dom exhibition sub-quality behavior........it's an issue and I tend to take things more rigid, seriously, and analytical. I can get frustrated and then take actions that are ..less than ideal for the dynamic.

Sense/knowledge deprivation should be discussed prior to exploring. I think that may be an issue is it's not being discussed and the experiment isn't consensual. Autonomy has been all that I understand as safety, mental and physical, seems to be guaranteed in my control.

Perhaps I should learn to choose more wisely....

[aw****]

1 hour ago, lostInSwizzerland said:

Perhaps authenticity isn’t the absence of intention. Perhaps it’s what remains when you stop trying to control the outcome.

You don’t necessarily need to understand every reaction while it’s happening. Sometimes the more interesting question is whether you feel safe enough to look at it afterward without turning it into another reason to judge yourself.

And as for your little contradiction between filthy desires and pure tyranny… I suspect those two aren’t nearly as far apart as you’d like to believe. 😉

The interesting part isn’t how far someone can push you. It’s discovering what happens when you meet someone who knows when to push, when to wait, and when not to let you hide behind the provocation.

But I have a feeling you already know that.

You just haven’t decided what to do with it yet.
🖤

Knowledge and execution.

I can analyze all day. In action, it gets muddled. It's pure desire.

The answer is basically, am I satisfied. Denial and inconsistency leaves me unsatisfied, locks away my trust, and dictates my patterns of control.

Oh to be able to be a true sub must feel euphoric.

[an****]

Friday at 10:47 PM, awsmx3rain said:

Ha. I think the Dom/sub-switch conflict gets reduced to "brat" but I'm not sure as I really have little evidence for that opinion.

The desire to know all the possibilities sometimes turns into anxiety or infuriates doms. "why all these questions?" "You'll see" " be a good girl." It's very low support. 🫠 The examination is meaningless when control is the root. Then it becomes a power struggle. And my brat says....hold steady.

Frustration leads to "acting out" of sub mindset...build obedience? Never me. Reassurance and consistency? Leads to sub possibilities. Because I would rather sit in enjoyment and pleasure than sadness and confusion, I'll just create my own enjoyment. 🤷🏽‍♀️ Again, brat mode.

Any deviation from the norm is discerning to me and causes anxiety. But when the pattern of the dynamic is the Dom exhibition sub-quality behavior........it's an issue and I tend to take things more rigid, seriously, and analytical. I can get frustrated and then take actions that are ..less than ideal for the dynamic.

Sense/knowledge deprivation should be discussed prior to exploring. I think that may be an issue is it's not being discussed and the experiment isn't consensual. Autonomy has been all that I understand as safety, mental and physical, seems to be guaranteed in my control.

Perhaps I should learn to choose more wisely....

Very sorry, I didn't get this notification, I came back to check and see you replied. Apologies.


I am saying 'acting out' and 'brat' are separate. I am inviting you to challenge that if you do not agree. Acting out looks like a lost of trust in the dynamic and turns into 'toying with a mouse' behavior. No longer for the enjoyment of the dynamic like in bratting.

Sounds like a difficult situation TBH. I love communication and questions, you mean you want to know everything I took hours to plan and you are excited to hear me describe everything so you know how to perform 🙄🥵 why can't that not be my problem 🤣. I do understand, it is definitely not everyone's cup of tea, but also sounds like a miss-match is all. The dom may just not understand what they consent to, if they understand sub and brat differently. Written definitions would help if this is a common thing.

Obedience? No. You are describing obedience with structure, you just require significant structure. Again, you may have luck with drafting a personal user manual.

Model: Rain
Role: Sub switch
Dom triggered: idiots 🤣
Trigger detail: will ask a lot of questions and if you are stupid mockery will ensue, lack of structure/knowledge, if I don't know what to do I'll be 'bad' because I get nervous/anxious

If your dom or sub is getting frustrated it is a good idea to take a break (break the whole scene) and talk about what is happening what the conflicts are why there is frustration and what the expectations are including boundaries. Remember the scene is less about sex and more about connection and to truly enjoy the sex you have to do the connection work or what's the point?

I have said it on other posts, if a sub is intentionally breaking rules or acting out or disobeying, the reward is not worth it and that's really important to figure out what is happening. That is dynamic breakdown territory.

Least I forget you experience sensory and knowledge deprivation immediately 🙄🤣 so getting less is not helpful. Exactly though there should not be any surprises unless surprises (your favorite) are discussed and negotiated prior to play.

Contract autonomy, is in sub control in a proper sub space. This is the whole point of sub space and why consent, boundaries, and trust are discussed and negotiated. The sub may not have the ability to stop, pause, or negotiate while in play. If the sub is already terrified of not understanding what's happening from the very beginning it's no wonder why someone (with the ability) would switch to a protective position.

Perhaps, or train one.
#adoptadom