Sadism

[Go****]

At what point does sadism become immoral. Is there a line that shouldn't be crossed and how do you draw that line.

[Lu****]

You communicate! Everybody has different tolerances

[69****]

Without consent or when it’s endangering their life

[du****]

I'm a ***slut, so for me my *** levels are high, so sadism to me will be different than another sub, so it's a moving line .

[Cy****]

Honestly depends on each person where the line is

[In****]

If one was to cross any negoriated line. Then it becones wrong or immoral. I would also add if there was no negotiation offered. Without clear consent, most if not all actions cross the line.

[Ch****]

Is the answer like the definition of pornography? You know it when you see it? About the most specific thing we can think of is when it's non-consenting and/or damage lasts more than a week? It's such a weak linear definition, but it holds for us. Bruises, cuts, etc should be gone in a week. Our only exception are burns which aren't so strong to be permanent. Mental sadism must be addressed in aftercare and be consensual. Not sure how to address your question past that, because so many things can be sadistic.

[Ha****]

First indication that line has been crossed is when it is no longer Mutual Pleasure . When one of the parties or not getting the pleasure or Joy they were getting from it previously but yet they feel they need to continue to have the other one around in their life as far as being immoral I would say that is when somebody approaches the other participant as a predator using manipulation to achieve their goals when they stop thinking of the other person as a partner in the situation when open communication is no longer a safe topic all the things like that it can be a fine line but the line is definitely there and open communication about everything even the smallest point can strengthen relationship and not have to go toxic

[ab****]

Well, the easiest line is when it causes permanent, irreparable harm. At that point, no consent really justifies that imo. If you're causing fractures, breaks, concussions, or anything similar, that shows a lack of control, skill, or both. I'm even a bit iffy on things that can cause scarring, because people can regret those actions much like people can regret tattoos (not putting the blame of regret on any dom if they got enthusiastic consent, but should be considered a possibility).

I think with anything more extreme, boundaries and expectations should always be discussed beforehand. I know it can sometimes slip the mind in the heat of the moment, but if you haven't discussed it beforehand, it really shouldn't be done.

I'm sure some people will argue about specifically the immortality bit, since at some point you just strip each layer back and just start arguing about what *is* morality; I think the main focus should be that at the end of the day, the objective is temporary pleasure, and that comes from taking enjoyable, non-permanent actions, from which you both derive pleasure (because pressuring your dom to hurt you is still wrong, just like pressuring your sub to let you hurt them).

tl;dr so long as you both want to do it and it's non-permanent, go for it

[JA****]

That is a Peter Murphy song.
The line between the devils teeth.
Haha

[so****]

Morals are subjective. So yes... And no

[Cade]

For me, the primary consideration would be consent. I use this as a general line as it is the easiest line to draw: a person is aware and understands (to the best of their ability) the activity or interaction, and is able and willing to consent (not inebriate or being manipulated/coerced, as examples). Of course, mutual understanding isn't always so easy to ensure for a variety of reasons, unfortunately.
Beyond that, there are some additional legalities to be considered, though in a dynamic where even the slightest flogging or infliction of païn would be seen as illegal (as in many place, one cannot technically consent to being harmed), it is difficult to consider that line as society has already placed that line that makes most everything a sadist may want to do, in fact, illegal. In my own personal ideology, I refer back to consent (i.e: I don't have an issue with public play due to the legality of indecent exposure laws, but rather I defer to the concept that I don't have the consent of someone walking up on us, if that makes sense).
Then I think we come to the sticky icky of this question, actual moral consideration: the point in which sadism becomes immoral would be something to weigh against your actual belief and spirituality, and yours alone. That last part is rather important, I feel, as everyone desires their own level of participation, their own interests to explore and to what degree; we should remember what may be too much for us, may be too little for someone else - and that's okay!

Edited August 14 by Cade

[SE****]

Sadism is a little different from other kinks, it’s something that can bleed into sexuality but is not inherently sexual. Sadism is causing suffering and its crux is that concerning yourself with others will be a line you draw or will be drawn for you. Sadism doesn’t draw it, it doesn’t have a line. Other things limit it.

[xR****]

I am a huge *** slut, but the best I can say is this; as a sadist, you want to inflict ***. But, it's *** with a purpose. In a BDSM relationship, both the S and M should be enjoying the *** being provided. The line is simple; hurting to hurt without regard for the masochist. Once it becomes beyond what they can handle, or beyond what has been consented to, that's when the line has been crossed.

[To****]

Everyone else already hit the mark. Consent between adults and all is well. Take that away and not acceptable

[Daddybrains]

Start with this definition: sadism fetishizes causing ***. Then expand to this one: sadism fetishizes being the cause of another’s reaction. These become immoral when done selfishly and without consent. There are other lines that I personally won’t cross, such as doing permanent harm, but those are more about ethics than about morals.

[Ki****]

lol

[ji****]

Thats a personal line for each individual. Your line might not ne as far as another's is to be comfortable

[ey****]

when it's not consensual. next. 

[da****]

CNC not a big fan of that! The lines can get blurred! Would have to know someone really well sexually!

[Irreverentdom]

Every single masochist has a different threshold that any Dom or Domme worth their salt would know about. It crosses a line when there is deliberately ignorance of safe words should they be in play. Safe guarding measures being ignored. If there's ***d play without consent. It's all about communication, trust and setting obvious limitations the partner doesn't cross, which if they do. Kick them to the curb, report them if it's abusive.

[te****]

Morals are personal. Pushing ones morals onto another person can be difficult and ***ful.

Align morals via setting a scene.
Open dialog and boundaries.

Personally some sadism is a bit too much for me.
However if each party is open willing consented and there is dialog before during and after. Then everything should workout

[DarkArts1066]

The answer should be “When it goes against the wishes of the person that you are inflicting that sadism on.”

This is a no-brainer for a sensible human being, should not be open to interpretation.
It is a simple question of consent - or should be, but the reality is considerably different.

It also encompasses the question of “Limits”, or rather more specifically, the incredible vulnerability of individuals who claim that they have “no limits”.

Those if you who know me, know that I have very strong views on this question.

Let’s take an example.

I was once approached by a young submissive, at an event, who struck up a conversation with me about the subject of me inflicting a number of sadistic acts upon her.

She claimed at the start, to have “no limits”.
I could, in effect, do what I wished to her - with her full consent.

Now, I know where my own limits lie, and what I consider to be a step too far.

I let her lead the conversation, wanting to understand where her own depths might lie regarding sadistic acts.

We discussed needles, knives, razors, heat, cold, various forms of *** in a roleplay environment…. We chatted for a good hour on the subject.

I wanted to find her actual limits, despite her continually telling me that she didn’t have any.

I won’t go into specific detail here, but I threw something into the mix -NOT something that I actually wanted to do, but something I felt was so extreme that she wouldn’t even consider it….

She paused, -actually paused for almost a minute, before answering me, as cool as a cucumber…..

She needed more time to consider what I had suggested.
Something which I am confident would have many people running for the hills, or possibly contacting the authorities.

What frightened me, in that moment, was that -If I had been of the right nature, I could easily have ***d this young woman, all in the name of my own gratification.
The result would have been life changing for her.

We chatted for months afterwards. I was concerned for her…. genuinely worried that she was ***. I tried to explain that she could find herself the victim of serious ***….
Her response was that if that was what the universe had in store for her, then so be it.
I was gobsmacked.

Eventually we lost touch.
She broke off contact, -I believe because she felt I wasn’t as adventurous as she wanted or needed me to be. (We never “sessioned” together.)

I hope, - really hope, that she is happy and thriving. She was beautiful, and exciting, and full of life and wonder.
But in truth, I just don’t know.

Today, if someone approaches me, claiming that they have no limits, I will disengage politely.

Everyone has limits.
There are people out there who will *** anyone who claims that they don’t have limits -for their own satisfaction.

Some “sadists” are in fact, monsters.
Sorry to leave a negative spin on this… but bad things happen to good people.
Always remember that.

[co****]

Easy…. When you cross someone’s safe word

[Sn****]

Trust. More words can be said, but let's reduce it to its core. A shared understanding of testing our limit together.