Your message is too short

[wo****]

6 hours ago, Aranhis said:

Precedent, running all the way through Fet's history, tells us they won't. The men who need to hear advice the most - who indeed often solicit it in the first instance - will then disregard and even argue against it, particularly if it comes from women or from men who support/understand a woman's perspective. 

All sorts of people who need advice the most, as you put it, disregard and argue against it. It’s seen in some women too.
Side note- my advice is to always use qualifies like I did. I could have said “it’s seen in women too” It makes a big difference by adding‘some’. Without *some* it will be perceived by more people to be insulting and unfair. Adding ‘some’ is more accurate. You also come across as more fair, reasonable, respectful, and responsible when you do so. The point about more emotionally charged responses if the advice comes from a woman I agree it will often be the case. The same is true in reverse. Women who need to hear the advice the most also disregard and argue against it too, particularly if it comes from a man.
In either sex things like personality disorders or having significant traits but don’t rise to meeting the criteria to be diagnosed as having the disorder(s). Addictions and codependency and also ideologies themselves or in combination with the other things I mentioned.
People also have a range of different cognitive biases which distort their thinking. It happens on an *** level. When you challenge a person’s strongly held beliefs they experience cognitive dissonance. It provokes negative energy like anxiety because they have a different idea challenging their beliefs. Very discomforting. They often act out to varying degrees, insulting, delivering attacks on a person’s character, becoming emotionally charged, arguing irrationally, etc driven ***ly and with emotion.
Change is difficult, even when it is positive change.
Q. How many psychiatrists does it take to change a lightbulb?
A. Only one, but the lightbulb has to want to change.

[wo****]

6 hours ago, TheGoodGirl_ said:

From a female perspective: yes, we get bombarded. No, it isn’t our obligation to sift through hundreds of messages (with significant amount of rude comments and messages), to get to the ones that actually are capable and willing to string more than 3 words together.

I am very amused that everyone here wants to get laid but most of you are not willing to read a profile text or come up with a message that is not generic and still expect each of us to just be ok with opening our legs for zero effort and also trust you enough, given this is a fetish site and there might be other factors at play for us women to be safe .

God forbid some of us want to actually talk before we sit on your face 🤣🙄🤷🏽‍♀️

I understand the sentiment. You are looking at it from a place of privilege though. The man has to do all the work. Women just exist and men come to them. When a woman complains about all of the various options she has she is ignoring the fact that it’s a luxury to have those options in the first place. Men don’t have those options. It sounds like entitlement. You get to sit back and choose. The men work and struggle, trying to figure out and become what you want. Think someone complaining about a buffet of food brought to them. That dish looks a day old, this one is overcooked, that one is undercooked, these both taste like shit. OMG I lost my appetite. Doing that while some guy who is skin and bones, starving with no food and salivating looking at your buffet and listening to you complain about it.
Not a good look. Shows a lack of respect for men. Women never used to show their ass like that. It’s not that the men turned shitty. They haven’t changed. Same positives and negatives.
Some women experience ignorant bullshit from men without expressing contempt, ridicule, anger, or rage. They select who they want without trying to embarrass, shame, mock, or humiliate men. They are beautiful and graceful. Men desire them and walk away with a smile and appreciation for them when those women reject them. Doesn’t happen as much as it used to.
“Every time you point your finger at someone else you are pointing three fingers back at yourself”

[wo****]

5 hours ago, PresentisPeculiar said:

First... what with the demanding tone and aggressive approach? , That would make me do anything but..

2nd. The answer is in your framed question. They're in that situation so they don't need to accept baseline and subpar material. In scenario that you describe, desperation has set in and you're willing to accept anything. But forcing someone to answer what would they do and that situation is pretty funny when the answer is "doesn't matter. I'm not. Do better."

I hear you and I see you. I understand your perspective. Do you think you are fair and reasonable with people? Do you think your approach to interpreting and critiquing men is consistent with the way you interpret and critique women? Do you think that you are mindful of your own messaging to avoid expressing views or qualities you criticize others for having?

[wo****]

4 hours ago, holygoth said:

standards can still exist.

Do you think I disagree with that?

[wo****]

3 hours ago, defy420 said:

Idk, I’m always messaging women trying to get to know them but then never get a response back or they send a not interested message. I feel like with this app there’s a lot of hit and Miss. and in my case all miss. But I’m still here and hopeful I’ll catch someone’s eye. I mean I can’t be that ugly can I?

Thanks for sharing your experience.
I’m commenting as if talking to the readers , being selfish and lazy by not making a new post- From what I’ve been hearing about men from posters in this app you are a rare breed.
Sending lots of messages to women and you get no responses or not interested. I hear that’s a common experience with lots of men here. But it’s almost unbelievable that you don’t whine and bitch about it. You just take it in stride without anger or blame. And not only that, your outlook moving forward is hopeful.
After all of the complaints and ridicule towards men for having ill manners, you could be in for a lot of praise and recognition for being reasonable and understanding. I considered that to be the norm but I don’t hear about men being decent people on Fet. I hear they are selfish, lazy, poor mannered, and that they blame women for their own problems.
You broke the mold!
I wonder if men having qualities that you have will be talked about here with any kind of regularity because I hear over and over that men are bad in one way or another very often

[Ar****]

7 hours ago, woburn169344 said:

 

How long do you think you would keep that policy for if you had no relationship, no partner, no replies to messages you send, and no people contacting you?
Don’t explain or elaborate what you would do without answering my question first. It’s simple and straightforward.

About another thirty years or so.

[Ar****]

6 hours ago, PresentisPeculiar said:

 

First... what with the demanding tone and aggressive approach? , That would make me do anything but..

2nd. The answer is in your framed question. They're in that situation so they don't need to accept baseline and subpar material. In scenario that you describe, desperation has set in and you're willing to accept anything. But forcing someone to answer what would they do and that situation is pretty funny when the answer is "doesn't matter. I'm not. Do better."

You get it 😊 thank you

[ey****]

9 hours ago, Bidude_69 said:

 

I wouldn't call it entitlement but common curiosity to say thanks but no thanks. Something has seem to be a long forgotten thing these days.

you know when you get junk emails, or mail through the door, that you're not interested in

do you

a) delete it / put in the bin

b) phone/reply to say "oh, cheers - but no thanks" ?

cos really, yeah - we delete the junk

and, I hate to say this - but most of our messages are little more than junk to folk who aren't interested.

The other take, of course... I mean sure, someone with an inbox full of messages could waste fuckloads of time going "thanks, not interested" - but then in some cases this is case closed... in others, there'll be those who message "but why though?", or who push for feedback - or who get aggressive about it.  And it's simply not worth the while.

I don't get why this is difficult

Even demanding a "thanks but no thanks" is entitlement.

[wo****]

8 hours ago, PresentisPeculiar said:

First... what with the demanding tone and aggressive approach? , That would make me do anything but..

2nd. The answer is in your framed question. They're in that situation so they don't need to accept baseline and subpar material. In scenario that you describe, desperation has set in and you're willing to accept anything. But forcing someone to answer what would they do and that situation is pretty funny when the answer is "doesn't matter. I'm not. Do better."

Why first? There was nothing that could be understood as demanding or aggression until the end, assuming telling someone to do something is best categorized as not just demanding, but also “aggression”. That isn’t necessarily the case though. When people state that someone else says is more offensive and objectionable than it actually is, while implying or saying that they or others are victims of it, is appears to me they are developing that scenario as a way to attack them. It’s a false accusation of sorts. It says person A is doing something worse than they did and implies person B is more wronged than they were. Receiving a message that tells them to respond in a particular way or taking up for the person receiving the the message… and suggesting they be considered victim suggests to me that it’s a sneaky way to malign the person who sent the message. People who do that are pretending to be victims as a way to attack the reputation of the person they say did wrong. It’s It a tactic of someone some call a Cry Bully. When it’s done time and again it strengthens the validity of having that view.
Responsible adults speak honestly and hold themselves accountable for their actions to anyone who hears, sees, or reads what they do and say. They own their actions. Bullies justify their misdeeds and blame others.
No one needs to accept anything I say. No one has any obligation to do what I say, besides my child as long as my directive is reasonable, even if he doesn’t want to. The scenario/ hypothetical I described was an exaggerated representation of the actual, real circumstances of men being talked about. I did it as a means of suggesting he look at it from their perspective. I told him to answer directly first because I had reason to believe he has a tendency to emphasize and see it from the opposite perspective. I couldn’t know if he would sidestep the question and narrate from his perspective instead. But I know his perspective and that he tends to argue from a woman are victims and men are bad view. So I did it to emphasize paying attention to the question and try to trigger him to give it more consideration than he naturally would. It wasn’t mean, it wasn’t me giving orders, and it wasn’t arbitrary. It’s also not something I do much. It was an approach out of character for me. I explained my reasoning for doing it. People can not like it and think I was wrong. I’m open to a good faith back and forth about it with anyone.
Equating it to FORCING someone is a crazy lie. No reasonable person would read it and think it’s forcing someone. That’s a much more unfair description than your earlier ones. If you believe that to be a fair description an not some kind of biased mud slinging I look forward to seeing how you classify similar situations done by people with views similar to yours.
And the answer is definitely NOT “doesn’t matter” it might be no or fuck you or it doesn’t matter to me. Saying doesn’t matter means that objectively it has no bearing on the matter. I could whine and bitch and use language to imply you are horrible for say that and all of the ways I am invalidated and go on and on. It’s a not obvious to most sneaky and dishonest way to claim you are horrible and caused me great harm as your *** suffering victim.
Do better.

Talking about insults or personal attacks on a person’s character or reputation is
The question is a hypothetical I created. No answer is there. The answer is the mind of the person I asked. Nowhere else. It was given later in this thread. The Hypothetical question I sought an answer to

[ey****]

5 hours ago, woburn169344 said:

Eye- so this person DIDN'T reply - therefore I'm going to punish someone else by just not putting in any effort at all.
Me- Are you insane? Your take on that is absurd. He is “punishing” someone by not putting in any effort at all? What did I miss in the op ? Who has the “entitlement” to his time, energy, and labor? And why the fuck do you claim it’s punishing someone when this guy doesn’t give people things they have no right to?

So to explain simply.  I guess ultimately no one is also owed an effort when being reached out to, sure, but low effort is rarely going to yield the desired results.

But it's like someone took to one person, put in a little effort - didn't get the results they wanted, so have now decided the next person isn't getting any effort.  So what the next person gets is junk. And the sender KNOWS he is sending low-effort junk.  It was a deliberate decision to not write with care. A deliberate decision to not give one person he claimed to be interested in the same dedication to someone else he claimed to be interested in.

Again, it's not like people are asking for war and peace, or reems of paragraphs, in fact the opposite.   Two bits of advice I got a while ago was simple, one was "I do not read messages that are above 250 words", the other was "Keep it brief but make it count" and like, sometimes context applies - it can be different if it's someone you have rapport with already (through forums, online interaction, real life interactions, etc) 

But like, it is very easy to send a message which is above minimum effort but isn't laborous.  And, I guess, you know - there might not be a response, but you can at least know you approached well and that's good practice.   Dealing with rejection (and no reply is often a rejection) is a crucial part of adult life in general.

[wo****]

2 hours ago, Aranhis said:

About another thirty years or so.

And your estimation for your life expectancy is how many years from now till death?

[Ar****]

4 hours ago, woburn169344 said:

Side note- my advice is to always use qualifies like I did. I could have said “it’s seen in women too” It makes a big difference by adding‘some’. Without *some* it will be perceived by more people to be insulting and unfair. Adding ‘some’ is more accurate. You also come across as more fair, reasonable, respectful, and responsible when you do so.

Side note - I did qualify my comment. I *specifically* noted, if you'll care to check, that it was for the gentlemen who were not going to listen (a little ironically at this point). Nobody else. Not for any of the ones who do pay attention, who do listen, who do make an effort to understand and learn. Just the ones who dig their heels in, show entitlement, take no responsibility and are not willing to grow.

 

You've done exactly what you have on other threads before now, inferred things which aren't there and preached about poor forum behaviour whilst demonstrating far worse decorum yourself. 

[FETMOD-BD]

I think this conversation has been done to death - locking this thread now