Letting things develop naturally

[jinxed]

Beforehand: I don't have 30 years of experience, so this is based on my personal idealistic ideas.
'Within the lifestyle', I had the chance to be involved with two men so far who both hadn't had any experience with BDSM. Therefore with both it was a journey of discoveries for both of us that couldn't have been more dissimilar from one another. There were no lists of things we liked or didn't like given out beforehand. Instead there was chemistry, fantasies being shared (albeit reluctantly from my side because I was so ashamed of them back then), and sometimes plain and simple experiments.
Did everything work perfectly? No, there were moments I had to stop mid-action because it felt wrong or where my partner turned a situation into something that I hated. Once I learned to discuss these events, they became stepping stones instead of obstacles. But the main aspect was that we were two individuals who were developing something together. Had I gone into it saying "Here is my list, see what works for you" or "I'm a slave/pet/..." I believe I would have missed out on those magical, surprising moments but more importantly on this joint venture of discovering what connected the two of us even more. Where I was the most obedient slave for one, I turned into a vicious little prey with the other. 
I understand that it is important to state likes and limits, but does it really have to be in advance? Can't it develop over time as I get to know my counterpart? I'd be very curious to hear what other people think about this, because I know that the lists are used for a reason. I just feel like they inhibit a more natural development. 

Edited June 7 by jinxed

[Si****]

I totally agree with you, a D/S relationship is still a relationship. It develops and evolves over time; personally I find most joy in discovering what my partner and I enjoy (or don't). You don't go into a more traditional relationship writing out every little thing beforehand either. Of course lists can be helpful to set boundaries within you can explore but they're not needed if there's mutual trust and good communication.

[ey****]

I think for the most part, things do develop other time with people.

However, also at the start whilst there may well be an open minded approach - there's always things that people might specifically want to try (based on prior fantasies) or things that they particularly don't, even if that may be changeable with time.

I guess, however, a thing is - now you have had that period of experimentation - you will have things that you know you like, or discovered you like - and things that you know you dislike and wouldn't wish to do again.  So any future experiences already shifts your position.  Any further relationships while there's still likely scope for experimentation - there are activities there's little sense in repeating as you know you don't like them and then those you may be drawn towards because you do.

[Schmerzhaftschön]

First of all, I am really happy for you! I personally prefer do have an overview of general likes/ limits because I don't want to invest much time into someone who doesn't share at least 60/70% of my likes - as it takes time for me to decide: yes, we can start a d/s relationship. I am a HUGE fan of development over time - as we grow with our playpartner, and the remaining fantasies can be discovered over time.
Of course, if someone is new and open to experiment - The list will create itself over time. I like to build on top of (already existing) lists, or contribute to new variations of the same 'kink' or fantasy. Someone might enjoy x, but everyone executes x in a different way which makes it more interesting. I think that lists provide a good base, and even if it's not there yet - if both parties get along, it can be discovered together.

[jinxed]

9 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I guess, however, a thing is - now you have had that period of experimentation - you will have things that you know you like, or discovered you like - and things that you know you dislike and wouldn't wish to do again.  So any future experiences already shifts your position.  

You might think that's the case. But what I find is that it depends completely on the partner I might encounter in the future. Maybe I just didn't like the execution with a former partner while I might love the experience with someone who does it differently. A new partner might bring out completely different aspects of me again which turn everything on its head and with this person things I used to love just wouldn't make sense. So you see, I just can't see the benefit of bringing my checklist with me. But I get you point of course. 

[jinxed]

39 minutes ago, SirL_anon said:

 Of course lists can be helpful to set boundaries within you can explore but they're not needed if there's mutual trust and good communication.

It's all down to the communication, isn't it? I thought about this yesterday. Be that non-verbal or verbal communication. And considering that we are (what is it 99,9%?) @nimal, this makes complete sense. But communication develops. It's not just done at some point, and so this can apply to this subject as well.  

Edited June 7 by jinxed

[do****]

I believe listing out your likes dislikes takes a lot of the fun in being in a relationship with another. One of the key pieces of intimacy is exploration. It generates the baseline for intimacy exploration. Some may already know what they like and feel the need to list it. Where others wait for another to discover those boundaries and limits on their own will. Perhaps as a test of tolerance between each individual vs any individual.

[Fr****]

I think that you going into this open-minded is the best to do. A lot of people have lists and seem to be looking for that one person that has the exact matching list of wishes etc. This limits the possibilities to experience something new and leads to a lot of frustrations. Because, are you really going to find that perfect match? Most probably not. Anyway, enjoy the journey!

[Deleted Member]

the important thing to remember is that each D/s pairing is different. some naturally flow faster than others and that is perfectly fine. Some use contracts and others do not. the guiding principle is in which situation do you feel safe and even more important trusting your Dom to lead you.

[Qu****]

I go in with almost no list, just a couple of hard no's. And I will explain to them that until there is trust, they will only trigger past trauma.

[No****]

I'm new to this and exactly the type of thing I'm looking for

[SweetLittleAngel]

I'll be honest, my experience with exploring and learning as you go with my ex-husband was a BAD one. We started out rather innocent, and I fell in love with him, but we discovered over a decade together that we were sexually incompatible, no matter how much we loved each other, and it completely broke our relationship, as well as completely broke ME. I spent years pushing myself into kinks that weren't mine to fulfill his needs because I loved him and wanted to make things work, and it literally broke me. I would MUCH rather start out a new relationship knowing more about how compatible my potential partner and I are, rather than falling in love again and THEN finding out that we're not sexually compatible. I mean, I don't have to know EVERYYTHING about my partner's sexual desires, but I need to know the basics at least, and to know that my potential partner and I are compatible.

[Ve****]

I would rather go into a relationship with no expectations and a few hard limits rather than just give them a list up front. Its a learning experience for both people.

[Ro****]

I too like my dynamics to develop naturally. I've been poly a decade now, with more than one established long term anchor. Though I do start with stricter boundaries in a new situation for safety, in both mind and body. I know until the trust is gained, there are certain things that may trigger the wrong response. How they deal with navigating that with respect to the boundaries and communication is the foundation of building it. I've tried the whole list thing. It can be inhibiting or even overwhelming to start there.Things can change from one dynamic to another and even from one scene to another. Let it come naturally, the connection is so much better for me this way.

[Bi****]

Personally, I would never be with someone who has no experience. I am not prepared to teach a Dom how to Dom while I want to be in the position of a sub. That's just too much dual responsibility. There's also too much left open for interpretation including the chance for *** of power. My perspective partner MUST have experience and a strong understanding of how D/s dynamics generally work. The rest develops naturally as all people are still human with their own preferences and limits, and relationships all have their own vibe.

[ch****]

I’ll admit it’s communication. But with my experience. The ladies I attracted are more interested in something else. My first girlfriend was older she was bisexual into BDSM / Swinging . But my first fiancé thought it was how can I say this. She was a hypocrite. She had BDSM Video tapes but was very vanilla underneath. My second fiancé was the opposite but much like my first Fiancé. To conservatives yet didn’t want to admit what they really wanted. The communications were lost because both terrible and terrified at explaining or expressing our views. Towards what our goals were.

[jinxed]

29 minutes ago, chicago38936 said:

I’ll admit it’s communication. But with my experience. The ladies I attracted are more interested in something else. My first girlfriend was older she was bisexual into BDSM / Swinging . But my first fiancé thought it was how can I say this. She was a hypocrite. She had BDSM Video tapes but was very vanilla underneath. My second fiancé was the opposite but much like my first Fiancé. To conservatives yet didn’t want to admit what they really wanted. The communications were lost because both terrible and terrified at explaining or expressing our views. Towards what our goals were.

Wow, I have never heard about someone being actually conservative while telling others - and most likely themselves - that they were kinky! Usually it's the other way around, isn't it? 
Do you have an idea what might have made them present themselves as kinky to the world? Because I don't think it would have been hypocrisy, but rather the very unhelpful form of some ulterior and innocent motive. Which of course could be anything, from wanting to please, to wanting to keep a partner, to wanting to impress, there must be hundreds of reasons for such behaviour. Did you ever get an inkling of what it might have been? 

[su****]

Yesterday at 04:33 PM, jinxed said:

Wow, I have never heard about someone being actually conservative while telling others - and most likely themselves - that they were kinky! Usually it's the other way around, isn't it? 
Do you have an idea what might have made them present themselves as kinky to the world? Because I don't think it would have been hypocrisy, but rather the very unhelpful form of some ulterior and innocent motive. Which of course could be anything, from wanting to please, to wanting to keep a partner, to wanting to impress, there must be hundreds of reasons for such behaviour. Did you ever get an inkling of what it might have been? 

It is possible to be both conservative and kinky. Just like religion and science can go together.

[an****]

Tuesday at 04:33 PM, jinxed said:

Wow, I have never heard about someone being actually conservative while telling others - and most likely themselves - that they were kinky! Usually it's the other way around, isn't it? 
Do you have an idea what might have made them present themselves as kinky to the world? Because I don't think it would have been hypocrisy, but rather the very unhelpful form of some ulterior and innocent motive. Which of course could be anything, from wanting to please, to wanting to keep a partner, to wanting to impress, there must be hundreds of reasons for such behaviour. Did you ever get an inkling of what it might have been? 

All forms of misdirection, misleading, misinformation, or false statements, come from a desire for control. Intentional or unintentional (habit). No different than comments about 'starting a business', 'im into gardening', sounds good, but without action is just a hollow claim. This happens a lot, instead of saying 'im interested', it is 'i am into' and that gives false presence to the other person's 'fit' filter. If you control the information you change everything that follows. The sad part is that people who change narratives get called out pretty quick when reality shows up and it's a devastating ego blow and is identity destabilizing.

[an****]

Sunday at 11:13 AM, jinxed said:

You might think that's the case. But what I find is that it depends completely on the partner I might encounter in the future. Maybe I just didn't like the execution with a former partner while I might love the experience with someone who does it differently. A new partner might bring out completely different aspects of me again which turn everything on its head and with this person things I used to love just wouldn't make sense. So you see, I just can't see the benefit of bringing my checklist with me. But I get you point of course. 

You're really onto something deeper there without mentioning it. With some of these dynamics crossing over into real relationships you really have to fully understand that 'an interest' hits a totally different visual to a new partner than a want, need, or 'this is my kink'. There's a certain level of humility with leaving the list to discovery. New partners can explore your interests without visualizing you with others. I have a lot of 'equipment' and I find it's easier for someone to hear, it was interesting so I bought it, rather than I bought it for a session. Your point has a lot of merit.

[jinxed]

On 6/12/2026 at 2:14 PM, anotherusername said:

 

You're really onto something deeper there without mentioning it. With some of these dynamics crossing over into real relationships you really have to fully understand that 'an interest' hits a totally different visual to a new partner than a want, need, or 'this is my kink'. There's a certain level of humility with leaving the list to discovery. New partners can explore your interests without visualizing you with others. I have a lot of 'equipment' and I find it's easier for someone to hear, it was interesting so I bought it, rather than I bought it for a session. Your point has a lot of merit.

This is very much on point in respect to what I have struggled with recently. When I'm getting to know someone and he tells me for example what kind of rules he has 'with his sub', it firstly hurts because phrasing it this way makes me feel like the next number in his catalogue, and secondly it makes no sense because he doesn't base them on our specific dynamic, so how can he know that this is appropriate for an interaction with me? Thank you for bringing this up. 
This is why being the first sub to my former partners was a very experimental and freeing experience. No catalogue, no expectations, just experimenting and discovering and both times it felt like the most special and unique experience throughout the time together instead of like the playing out of an age-old repertoire, just with a different toy. 

And it is very reassuring to see that quite a lot of people seem to have a more open-minded approach to establishing a dynamic. So there's hope. 

[an****]

1 hour ago, jinxed said:

This is very much on point in respect to what I have struggled with recently. When I'm getting to know someone and he tells me for example what kind of rules he has 'with his sub', it firstly hurts because phrasing it this way makes me feel like the next number in his catalogue, and secondly it makes no sense because he doesn't base them on our specific dynamic, so how can he know that this is appropriate for an interaction with me? Thank you for bringing this up. 
This is why being the first sub to my former partners was a very experimental and freeing experience. No catalogue, no expectations, just experimenting and discovering and both times it felt like the most special and unique experience throughout the time together instead of like the playing out of an age-old repertoire, just with a different toy. 

And it is very reassuring to see that quite a lot of people seem to have a more open-minded approach to establishing a dynamic. So there's hope. 

Thoughts on this being a boundary/limit? (Influencing language structure before roles are entered.)

Soft/hard limit: knowledge of prior subs/partners

I've recently taken an IRL role that is entry level. I am becoming more interested in ways subordinates can facilitate or guide superiors to function more efficiently when executive training is not working or is ineffective. Same here, no formal dom training to modify, so what actionable things can produce wanted results?

While talking about subs/ex is not what others would see as a breach of consent. I see any information/action that is given without consideration to impact is consent negligence at the very least. So it's worth setting a boundary if the action is causing damage, no matter how slight, or how unintentional.

What are you thoughts on this and could there be other boundaries/limits that could help solve this prior to it being a conflict point in the first place?

[jinxed]

21 hours ago, anotherusername said:

 

@anotherusername It would be less of a boundary or limit, but rather a premise, I suppose. The idea to bring it up early on instead of simply hoping for it is a good idea!

However, there's a difference for me between discussing past experiences (which might even be very insightful) and applying their principals to the new dynamic. Never ever would I expect behaviours and routines I had established with former partners with a new one. If they were to come up during interaction, fine. But nobody can be like the two Doms before, and I'm so curious about the next one because he'll change everything and I can't wait to see who I'll be with him and he'll be with me! 

But to answer your question: Yes, I believe there could be another premise that might help. Letting go of fixed ideas about a) who we both 'are' exactly in the kinky world and b) what makes a certain role like a brat/slave/pet or how they should behave. When I was told that I need to learn how a brat handles being teased, it felt like I was supposed to fit into a template. But how can any individual fit into a template? And again, it's about seeing someone as a unique person instead of a role. 

Thanks for this impulse! 

[do****]

Agreed. Listing out likes and dislikes kinda sends a misleading message that one is here to just “fu*k”. The experience of getting to know another on an intimate level can’t have pre-conditions. Hopefully through conversation those things will be revealed. That’s the thrill of “the hunt”. Connecting and understanding another through honest questions and answers. Intimacy to me has many levels. But it always starts off with a mature and intelligent conversation. Thanks for sharing.