Seeking advice after a potential trust violation

[Al****]

I experienced a minor mistake from my dom and partner of 3 years. I knew they didn't realize they made that mistake, figured it was an accident, and figured it would be fine once I told them. During aftercare of a session that I was allowing myself to push boundaries that I'm hesitant but are things they like, they were rather harsh in something that they said and that poked some very heavy insecurities. It wasn't intentional and I brushed it off at the time, but it continued to build and cause a lot of actual issues for me. I informed them later that what was said and how it was said in aftercare has hurt me and wasn't okay for them to do and that I felt that they violated some responsibility in aftercare by being careless in this way. They said that, yes, it was a mistake but that what they did was okay. I was very taken aback by this and expressed that I feel very strongly that they were wrong to do that and that they had slipped up. They told me directly they did not do anything wrong and got rather upset with me for saying otherwise.

 

The mistake itself was not that big of an issue and could have easily been resolved without any real damage. The problem here is that when I directly told them they had crossed a line they told me that they didn't. When I stated again that they crossed a line they again told me that they did not and were upset with me for saying so and I feel downplayed my feelings. I was not upset at them for crossing this line originally, it was not on purpose and I get that. But the fact that they continued to say that it was okay for them to do despite me telling them directly that it wasn't is why this feels like a major breach of trust, to me. We have been playing with this topic for years, and this is the first time that this has happened, but this has really upset me. I did not know what to do and between the feelings of trust being broken and them getting angry with me I and ended up crying rather hard, something extremely uncommon for me, to the point that they've never actually seen me sob-crying in any time we've been together. Nor have any of my friends or relationships, ever. The last time I actually sob-cried like this was maybe about 10ish years ago. After this, they told me that they won't ever again violate that trust.

 

They have broken my trust in the past, but never in this setting and not for a long time and it was something that we worked through. After them breaking my trust in the past I realized they had started showing signs of emerging bipolar disorder. It took awhile to convince them that they should seek help, but eventually they did. They have since realized how big of an issue that has played in their life and their relationship dynamics and have sought heavy therapy and are taking medication to assist in controlling it, we have both put a lot of effort into helping them accept and work through this aspect of them and we have seen major progress in that regard which is not a minor part of why I have been willing to extend try to extend trust to them once again. I mention this to explain the previous trust violations to help explain why I would be okay with someone who broke my trust in the past. It took us awhile to work through previous trust breaks, though, and I do trust them again, however since this happened I am feeling a hard time trusting them in anything they say or even things they've said in the past. I am experiencing a lack of trust that I have not felt since before discovering the mental health issues they deal with.

 

I am completely unsure of where to go from here. I don't know if I'm overreacting and I should just be fine with what happened or if what happened was as big of a deal as I feel it is. I'm feeling extremely conflicted and would greatly appreciate any advice that anyone has in this regard.

Edited December 28, 2019 by AllFoxedUp

[Be****]

You are NOT overreacting! You talked through something that made you uncomfortable and they belittled your feelings and although they admitted they did the thing they did not accept any responsibility in the way it made you feel. That is a huge red flag to me.. so much so that I would probably stop playing with this person. That feels very much like gaslighting to me and can be a slippery slope once on it. It shouldn't take you sob-crying to make them understand you feel awful over it, they should listen to how you feel because your feelings are VALID, and then they should work to rectify their mistake. Have you spoken to them since about it?

[Al****]

The crying happened last night, I've avoided them today.

 

I don't really know where to go from here. Everyone I've talked to or received advice from says that I'm not overreacting and that what they did[In regards to telling me that they did not mess up] is a huge thing. I should mention that when i said they told me that they won't ever do that again they did apologize. I wish it hadn't taken them seeing me at my literal worst in order for them to do that, though.

 

I don't really know what to say to them now, though.

[Rrrrroger]

If it's a discussed boundary then you are right to feel as you do, incidents like this can be a precursor to future lack of respect for your boundaries which may escalate if your Dom loses site of their responsibility to their sub.

[Be****]

7 hours ago, AllFoxedUp said:

The crying happened last night, I've avoided them today.

 

I don't really know where to go from here. Everyone I've talked to or received advice from says that I'm not overreacting and that what they did[In regards to telling me that they did not mess up] is a huge thing. I should mention that when i said they told me that they won't ever do that again they did apologize. I wish it hadn't taken them seeing me at my literal worst in order for them to do that, though.

 

I don't really know what to say to them now, though.

I think the fact that you are avoiding them speaks volumes. I'll give you the same advice that I give most people who say they don't know what to do; write it out in a journal of some description, all of it - what happened, how it made you feel, what you said to them and how they reacted to you and how you've felt since. Then write out 3 possible solutions (ie; talk to them again, sweep it under the rug and hope it never happens again, or break it off) and also how each of those solutions would make you feel. 

Sometimes something as simple as writing it all out can help you get everything clear in your own head and how you feel about everything x

[Simon_says]

You are right to feel the way you do. You have raised an issue that is important to you and you have been ignored and worse told that your view of agreed limits was wrong. My advice would be to look elsewhere for someone who deserves your trust.

[ey****]

I feel... everyone (can) make mistakes and it's all in about owning them and what you do about them.

I agree with you, it's not his mistakes that are the issue - but how he responded when you raised them.

There's a somewhat toxic Dominant cliche which I think comes a little bit from ideology and confusing fantasy/fiction of "every rule is my rule" and "I am the Dominant so you do as I say" - with things like that ultimately scenes created have to work for all involved.

In this lifestyle it can be difficult to find good partners and he needs to be appreciate he has a sub who is happy to try to do things for the Dominant, rather than push you away with his my-way-or-the-highway attitude. 

[Deleted Member]

You mentioned that it’s the second time they made the mistake! Seems like they don’t learn from them and push boundaries further and further. How long before it started to look like abuse ? 
you might need to take a time off or cooling period. It’s obvious that there is a lack of communications and agreements 

[Vandalslut]

All of the above is excellent advice and comfort, particular BerryBrighton's suggestion of journalling it all.  You can also contemplate what you advise a friend if she confided this same story to you.  But the biggest thing here is your Dom has professionally diagnosed mental health problems, which have had a destructive effect on your trust.  His doctor is satisfied that he has bi-polar disorder and he is receiving help and medication for that; my experience of people with this disorder is that they're on an immense 'up' one minute and 'down' the next. The unwillingness to accept responsibility for damaging or hurtful things he's said or done, plus his unwillingness to believe he had a problem at all, sounds very much like a narcissistic personality disorder  (my sister's ex had this and it destroyed the marriage).  However, I'm no doctor, and whichever your Dom has, neither disorder will go away with medication and counselling - the conditions can only be managed and only if the counselling and medication is constant; and in the case of narcissistic personality disorder, they practically never receive counselling because as far as they're concerned, there's nothing wrong with  them.  Please take everything into consideration before making a decision but on balance, it'd be best to end the relationship.  Don't hang in there thinking it'll all get better tomorrow - it won't.

Edited December 29, 2019 by Vandalslut

[Al****]

As we were going to bed last night they apologized and said they never should have said that, without my prompting them to bring it up. They've always been very respectful of my sexual boundaries prior to this and seem genuinely upset that they did something so cruel. Not just apologetic to me but honestly mad at themselves over this, like they never expected to be the kind of person who would do something like this. I did also write it all down today and consisdr my options, that was very good advice and I appreciate it! 

 

They've never broken this sort of trust before, when I say broke my trust previously it was in other ways and very much so related to the mental issues they face. However those issues still exist even behind the medication and therapy and they require so much of me during episodes that I find myself frayed trying to support them. The episodes seem to last about 1 to 2 months and happen twice a year. I can be a good supportive girlfriend for about 3 weeks before I start to deal with depression and other issues that make me unable to help them. This is week 5. =/

 

As far as anything kink related goes, it'll likely be awhile before I trust them and allow myself to be vulnerable. It sucks because I've never found someone I was so sexually compatable with before them. 

 

With the relationship... Im... reevaluating. I honestly do love them, but their actions here and the strain it all puts on me takes a toll I'm not sure I'm willing to pay for my entire life. 

 

 I wrote this because I genuinely appreciate the advice given here and thought it would be good to give some follow up info on this as you were all kind enough to take time to reply. =] 

[Vandalslut]

You could be my sister talking right now .  I remember she told me that she stayed in the marriage for as long as she did for the man she knew he could be and who she had believed him to be. He also professed to have no idea what he'd done wrong, or why it was so upsetting. But there were children involved, and in the end she had to leave and make a new life for their sakes as much as her own. You don't need to do anything in a hurry; but you are re-evaluating, which is very healthy.  Can you see yourself doing this for the rest of your life?  And will you ever trust enough to allow yourself to be vulnerable?  Breaking trust is breaking trust no matter in what way, if they've broken trust in other ways, this really isn't a very good situation at all.  It almost sounds as if there's a progression of trust-breaking going on. Not to mention that you're going under with the strain of these episodes.  You need to help yourself.  If you are not living with them, have some time out.  If you are, go and stay with family or friends and they are not to contact you or bother you - try the journalling BerryBrighton suggested in peace. This person has committed a major breach of trust, has crossed a line and refused to take responsibility for their actions. There are many more worthy of your trust and who will be equally, if not more so, sexually compatible.  We're all wishing you luck.

[Deleted Member]

I read your reply and think its time for you to have a break. I am not being rude but when mental issues are involved, the control during sessions is jeopardise. But not only that, you turn the table around and start finding excuses and apologise for them. I can tell you right now it won't be the last time you face this situation again, 

[ca****]

Just my angle on this...

This started out as a communication thing and got 'communicated' - i think it then became a personality thing / maybe even an understanding thing..... which seems like it may have got thru to them a bit further down the line time wise...   i also think the mental health aspect should not be ignored (as you are well aware) - that is always there *as it is in all of us- we all have states of mental health!)

I think much of the advice above is probably good - get it clear in your head (write it down if that works for you) - most of all the whole thing probably needs a discussion as you kinda reveal more the more you go into it.  I find that regardless of the role or the label we 'put' ourselves in and 'put' on others - we all still have our own responsibility in any 2 way relationship / communication.

 

I feel that you know best ... and that the way forward is probably in discussion and exploring this issue further - which may be uncomfortable (and something i would find v difficult!!!!!)

 

Keep well.

 

[Phoenyx]

As usual, I'm late to the party.  It sounds to me, that these folks not only stepped over the line, they remained over the line!  It wasn't until you became truly upset, that they finally backed off.  Yes, they violated your trust---big time.  No, you did not overreact.  On the trust issue, you are basically back to Square One.  They will have to rebuild your trust from scratch.

The mental-health thing concerns me though.  With their constant hiccups in demeanor, they may never be able to rebuild your trust.  Each new hiccup will be another step back---one step forward, and one step back; never getting anywhere.

A thought has crossed my mind.  Are either of these folks "natural" dominants?  By "natural", I mean, were they born with a dominant personality?  There is really nothing wrong with that.  I am a natural Dom.  However, our modern hierarchical society fears natural Doms.  They are seen as a threat to the status quo---something that needs to be crushed or destroyed.  The personality has to remain bottled-up, unable to express itself.  A lifetime of this can lead to all kinds of metal handicaps---bipolar disorder, depression, impulse control, etc...  Perhaps, if you again talk to these folks, you may want to approach the conversation from this perspective.

Hope this was of help.

[Al****]

As an update for anyone who posted, if they care to follow up, we're taking a break. I took all your advice to heart and thought it over for a few days, wrote it down, etc, and decided that it's for the best if I give this person some distance for awhile, maybe forever. It hurts, but you all were mostly very right. Thanks! 

[Vandalslut]

We're all wishing you good luck, AllFoxedUp. You're doing the right thing for yourself and you are the only one who can do the right for yourself.  And you're helping the other party with your decision as well, even if they may not think so at present.  Look after yourself and let us know how you are. Blessings and best, sending hugs ((( )))

[Si****]

You did the right thing. You have to follow what you know is right. It’s always hard but bask in the knowledge you had the strength to hold onto your morals and stood up for them. I (I’m sure it’s all here) hope you find what you need in the future.