Sometimes even Men have to say No

[thoughtcriminal]

Although this article is not strictly BDSM content, it's a true dilemma about connection to share, and would be interested in what both men and women would do in this situation.  I am a male and had to do one of the hardest things a man can do - decline the advances of a beautiful woman!!  Not only declining but declining when she had not used the usual cryptic language of making you an offer that most of us men are not hard wired to interpret (even with chat gpt).  I've had multiple times in my life where I've had what I call the Frying Pan moment.  When a woman makes you an offer, a chance to be intimate but she uses cryptic language that I don’t translate ‘in time’ and realizing too late,  wish to smash my face with a frying pan.  

Many years ago I was at a society meeting in a city late at night, which I didn’t live in and couldn’t get home, it was too late for buses or trains.  Walking home with a female colleague through the city she asked “why don’t you stay in my flat tonight?”  to which I replied (without thinking) “Oh it’s ok – I’ve arranged to stay with my mum tonight, I can crash on her couch……..”     Half an hour later I was still walking alone and I suddenly halted, realizing that I wanted to grab a frying pan and smash my face, my once in a lifetime opportunity gone.  I’ve been doing this my whole life.

I digress.  Back to Christmas eve 2024.  But to set the scene I’ll explain I had developed a friendship with a woman I had met at community college.  We got on great from the first moment and even went on some dinner dates, went to the gym and hung out.  However one night, at point blank range in the restaurant without warning she looked me straight in the eye and said “by the way, I’m not physically attracted to you…..”

I didn’t flinch, I didn’t react or try to defend myself – it’s one of the hardest things to hear from a woman you thought you were developing with.   Cool as a cucumber, assessing that perhaps she might be testing me in some way, and not trying to overthink it, I simply replied “fine…..would you like another wine?
You’d have thought my chances were dead in the water.  To make matters worse, she later cut me off her phone book and I hadn’t actually done anything other than treat her well and be kind to her.

Approximately a year later (a year!!) I received a text from her asking if we could meet up and do some Christmas shopping.  I was curious to ask why she had cut me off and thought I would give her the chance to explain herself.  She did eventually say that she was in a bad place and that it wasn’t actually to do with me.
So fast forwarding onto the main meat of this article.  We returned from the Christmas shopping, to her home where she lived in a small town.  My car had broken down at that time and I had missed the last bus – I had no intention of staying with her but circumstances dictated otherwise.
Later that night she got very drunk, so much so she could hardly stand up straight.  In her usual direct manner she asked me if I wanted to partake in taking *** and looking me in the eye said “and then let’s do some sexual things…..”

My dilemma was instant.  I could visualize  Mr frying pan hovering in the air ready to strike.

But I wasn’t drunk, I was in full control.  I didn’t want to take her ***** because they've never me ****,  just ill the next day with a sore stomach, a headache, gums feeling like they're shrinking and bleeding.  I had to process the moment and come to a difficult executive decision.  Remember this is the woman that told me to my face she wasn’t in to me.
I thought of all the daily newspaper stories you can read regarding the council official or manager who bangs the office secretary at the Christmas party, in the back filing room, she's so drunk, she’s struggling  to stand.  He then gets charged with *** and all the worse when his wife and kids read about it on the front pages.

I said to her that I wasn’t going to take her *** and wasn’t going to take advantage of her in such a drunken state.  She replied “oh it’s ok you don’t need to worry about that….”  
I had reversed the roles, turned the tables but I wasn’t proud of it.  She took offence to my rejection gracefully.  I did feel a little sense of sadness that once again the opportunity of real connection had been destroyed.

The next morning, at least I was feeling physically well, not hungover – unlike her.   I spent my Christmas alone, but also, without worrying about  police officers turning up asking me about a tryst with a drunken lady friend.

I felt I had done the right thing – and I’m guessing I’ll never hear from her again.  That chapter firmly closed.  So folks, what do you think?  Did I over think it - letting Mr Frying Pan win again? Did I show a lack of trust in her?  Could she have been telling the truth?
 

[SoftDomD]

Right decision in my mind.. as you’ve detailed, those situations can end horrendously and often isn’t worth the risk 🤷‍♂️

Fair play for having the self control too!

[Ar****]

You didn't overthink, you absolutely did the right thing.

The bigger thing I'm taking away from this thread is the ick of the title, but I'm hoping that's just poorly thought-out.

[ge****]

Absolutely the right decision not to take advantage of someone who was *** and incapable of coherent thought - not in the slightest what you are calling a "frying pan" moment either, and being honest I'm not sure the earlier story was one either - could simply have been a colleague who happened to be a woman offering to help out a colleague who was stranded, simple as that.

[Mi****]

Strike 2

[CopperKnob]

Yeah, you are overthinking it, in my opinion.
The first person suggested to you that you stayed the night, nothing more, the context being that you were stranded without transport.
The second person cut you off with a later explanation that they were in a bad place. During your next meeting with them when they made sexual advances, you describe them as being drunk to the point that they were unable to stand and one would surmise that they therefore couldn't have consented.
So, whilst you're here thinking you likely missed out on some good times, the first wasn't necessarily an advance and the second would have been classed as SA.
To minimise any future overthinking, I might think about making better arrangements for transportation so you don't keep getting into this situations.
FYI, women don't speak a cryptic language.
I'm also unclear about your title "even men have to say no." Again, the first story (As you've described it in your words) wasn't a definite advance and the second wasn't about "having" to do anything but use common sense. It's bizarre to me that this is what's causing you to overthink.

[CopperKnob]

2 hours ago, SoftDomD said:

Right decision in my mind.. as you’ve detailed, those situations can end horrendously and often isn’t worth the risk 🤷‍♂️

Fair play for having the self control too!

What? "Fair play for having the self control" you guys always tell on yourselves. Next I'm expecting you to tell us all it's the male biology that makes you act in a particular way

[Se****]

I applaud any and all efforts at open dialogue around sexual politics, especially anything that is attempting to advance male maturity in this area - which is sadly lacking - but I take instant issue with your title: "even men have to say no."
By saying "even" men you've already revealed your lack of evolution on the topic. That single word demonstrates that you're still trapped in a paradigm that presumes that men are always ready for and willing to have sex, and that saying no to it is a rare exception to some assumed rule (of biology, of culture, whatever, you don't really say).
However, I don't think you deserve the attack you're suffering here, because that will only serve to make you defensive and less likely to be open in the future.
Both sides can be in error, which is the case here.
Anyway: thanks for your thoughts and willingness to share them. I just think you have more work to do.

[thoughtcriminal]

3 hours ago, SoftDomD said:

Right decision in my mind.. as you’ve detailed, those situations can end horrendously and often isn’t worth the risk 🤷‍♂️

Fair play for having the self control too!

Thanks for your positive and supportive comment SoftDomD 

[SoftDomD]

1 hour ago, CopperKnob said:

What? "Fair play for having the self control" you guys always tell on yourselves. Next I'm expecting you to tell us all it's the male biology that makes you act in a particular way

In no way was I inferring that men in general lack that self control.. ‘some’ men do.. equally, so do ‘some’ women.. I don’t know anyone here from Adam, it was a simple comment, not meant to cause any upset. Apologies if it did.

[thoughtcriminal]

15 minutes ago, Senate said:

I applaud any and all efforts at open dialogue around sexual politics, especially anything that is attempting to advance male maturity in this area - which is sadly lacking - but I take instant issue with your title: "even men have to say no."
By saying "even" men you've already revealed your lack of evolution on the topic. That single word demonstrates that you're still trapped in a paradigm that presumes that men are always ready for and willing to have sex, and that saying no to it is a rare exception to some assumed rule (of biology, of culture, whatever, you don't really say).
However, I don't think you deserve the attack you're suffering here, because that will only serve to make you defensive and less likely to be open in the future.
Both sides can be in error, which is the case here.
Anyway: thanks for your thoughts and willingness to share them. I just think you have more work to do.

Thanks for the balanced and yet still positive feedback Senate.  Re the attacks - dealt with already

[Ne****]

Until the part of Her being very drunk, it all seemed typical and unfortunate .. missed opps and understandings. However, if *** at all and especially is very inebriated, there isn’t ever a time to say yes or go along with sexual / BDSM acts. I’d have thought this was a given but yikes I guess not.

[ey****]

In general, "No" is a very powerful word and everyone regardless of their role or gender should have it in their arsenal.

Whether that is "you're drunk and so I don't think we should" to "I don't wish to and do not owe an explanation" 

but yeah, the old rule you can't consent when drunk - and while people do sometimes play after some, a golden rule of "would this be consented to if everyone was sober" (and, even if yes, would this be more enjoyable for us all when sober)

-

I'm going to say, mind, while I relate to some of the 'frying pan moments' sometimes people are genuinely just being nice

I have had moments where I've been stuck for transport or having difficulties getting home and a female friend has said "you can stop at mine" (or we can split a hotel) 

And, what she means - in English - is "you can stop at mine" (or we can split a hotel) - be it, I have a couch, floor, spare room... or trust in you to not try funny business.   Sometimes that's all it is.

And sometimes the correct answer, is, yes - because it saves walking in the cold, trying to get a cab, wondering if a bus will show, or so on. 

[ge****]

4 hours ago, thoughtcriminal said:

Thanks for your positive and supportive comment SoftDomD 

I think most of the comments here have been positives to be honest - they may not seem so to you at face value - but if you stop and think about them, they most definitely are.

[Sa****]

I so very much respect you.

[Mu****]

I've had ladies call upon me when they're drunk. I've obliged. The worst is when they sober and keep the cuddles and kisses going til they see you tonight the door, only to get the text later. " it was great, but in wouldn't have done that if I was sober".... Not a great feeling. Especially when you're into the woman. Save the frying pan for your breakfast, you did the right thing.

[Th****]

Consent cannot be given when under the influence so the answer should always be no. 

Unless some comments have been deleted I don't see any attacks happening here. Constructive criticism given in simple and direct terms, yes, but no attacks. 

 

Edited February 22 by ThaliaV

[Deleted Member]

I don't think you need to bring the worry of police action into this thought process, what you did was right without that threat of *** from law en***ment.

You should be even more proud of yuour actions for how they are alone. You did the right thing. You don't need to justify doing the right thing.

[Deleted Member]

I'd find it a bit irritating that she was being facetious by telling you she wasn't into you but that's irrelevant. Of course you did the right thing.