The Mystery of the First Message

[do****]

46 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

The thing is, and in summary, you're effectively trying to draw the "men have it harder than women on sites like this" comparison and that's a complete fallacy - no category of user has it easier or harder, they all have their own different problems in one respect or another.
.
Yes a woman could probably get a man within a very short space of time on a site like this - but would then want that? In the majority of cases the answer will be "no" and certainly not just "any" man.
.
Can I suggest you go back and read my earlier post in response to you? As I risk repeating myself with this one.
.
For the overwhelming majority of men, they will struggle to get responses or interest, but not because of any number imbalance, or because of women having too high expectations, or any of the other things often cited - but because they simply haven't worked out how to approach sites like this - they send overly sexual messages without encouragement, or have the wrong expectations, attitude or approach, don't make an effort with their profiles and more besides.
.
Whereas there are men who do "get" how sites like this work, who do make all the right effort, who accept they won't get a reply to every message they send, who don't get butt hurt when they are rejected, who find an approach to the site that works for them etc - and those men are perfectly happy, and do come across to women in the right way, and as a result do get responses to their messages and indeed get to meet people, or accept that it may not happen.
.
All the tools are there for every man to use and make the most of the site - trouble is most don't use them, and seek to blame others for their own failure to do so

It starting to be a habit with this guy. What he said ☝️

[Ar****]

1 hour ago, Charlie218 said:

First of all I want to say and repeat that I’m generalizing here off course, I said that before.

Answering your statements here I go:
.
You don’t want us to be real, nobody would want that..
Any man being “real” would say or think: this girl look good I’d lie with her right away…
If we say so you all would run away and with all the rights of this world off course..
Furthermore I never generalized what woman wants, but how mostly man are dealt with in dating apps..

The elaborate and sophisticated bio go in second or third maybe grade of importance, bdsm is an exception, here is very important and everyone should do that accurately..
I’m talking more dating apps like tinder or Cupid that kind of things..

The real person btw come out with a lot of time getting to know each other, relating to each other..
.
I never said your profile is “basic” and I agree, as I already said, that people should read bio especially when bdsm is involved
.
Being ignored is the worst thing a human can experiment..
Recent born baby don’t die cause is treated bad, but cause is ignored (unlikely this experiment is real and has been conducted ).
I’m saying personally, I’d like 100 times more being objectified or being fetishized than being ignored.
So you don’t want to be ignored, nobody would want that.
The spooning things was just to say that woman has the possibility, not saying she would accept to spoon or to have sex lowering her standards, but at least you can have that, it’s not ideal but it’s something.

If a woman want a guy tomorrow to go to her house cause she feel into sex or bdsm she could get that in few hours chatting..
I could hardly say this could happen to any man..
A normal man In a normal situation have a very hard time to get laid.

I’m talking facts here, and I’m not against you or any woman at all, and not even saying man are poor victims of the society: I’m just acknowledging, I’ve done my research and I’ve been living things too.
I’m in an open relationship so something I can say I’ve been seen and leaving to rein*** my statements.

We are different, or biology is different, man instinctively want to join to as many woman he can for the sake of the species, and woman select the best mate for the sake and continuation of the species, and this is translated in the flirting process subconsciously…

There would be much more to say and would be beautiful debate more on human dynamics,I personally love it though I’m a very lazy typer ..

Wow. Please, just stop.

You start by saying you're generalizing - then immediately proceed to try and tell us that no women wants real and (in short) any man is led by his genitals. Those are two pretty definitive and all-encompassing statements, they don't leave room for generalisation - and you can't have it both ways.

There are far worse things than being ignored. Perhaps not to you, and that's okay, but not everybody is the same. How about we just acknowledge and respect that people feel differently about it?

I'm not going to sit and debate the matter with somebody who presents speculative opinions as definitively researched facts. I know futility when I see it.

But I will use my voice to distance myself and the many other decent men out there - who don't share your views/attitudes or think in terms of "getting laid" - from this sort of lazy toxicity.

[Fa****]

On 5/14/2023 at 9:19 PM, CopperKnob said:

What is this Tik Tok you speak of? 😂

You’re too old I’m afraid 😉

[Fa****]

1 hour ago, CopperKnob said:

OMFG!

I think what he’s trying to say is that (many/some) men have low/no standards and will take whatever a woman offers. Whereas women are the opposite and all of this is defined by biology (and our ancestors) as opposed to anything else. 

Am I right?? 

[Fa****]

57 minutes ago, Aranhis said:

Wow. Please, just stop.

You start by saying you're generalizing - then immediately proceed to try and tell us that no women wants real and (in short) any man is led by his genitals. Those are two pretty definitive and all-encompassing statements, they don't leave room for generalisation - and you can't have it both ways.

There are far worse things than being ignored. Perhaps not to you, and that's okay, but not everybody is the same. How about we just acknowledge and respect that people feel differently about it?

I'm not going to sit and debate the matter with somebody who presents speculative opinions as definitively researched facts. I know futility when I see it.

But I will use my voice to distance myself and the many other decent men out there - who don't share your views/attitudes or think in terms of "getting laid" - from this sort of lazy toxicity.

Sheesh, who put a penny in you and wound you up 😜

Edited May 15, 2023 by FatefulDestiny
Spelling

[do****]

52 minutes ago, Aranhis said:

Wow. Please, just stop.

You start by saying you're generalizing - then immediately proceed to try and tell us that no women wants real and (in short) any man is led by his genitals. Those are two pretty definitive and all-encompassing statements, they don't leave room for generalisation - and you can't have it both ways.

There are far worse things than being ignored. Perhaps not to you, and that's okay, but not everybody is the same. How about we just acknowledge and respect that people feel differently about it?

I'm not going to sit and debate the matter with somebody who presents speculative opinions as definitively researched facts. I know futility when I see it.

But I will use my voice to distance myself and the many other decent men out there - who don't share your views/attitudes or think in terms of "getting laid" - from this sort of lazy toxicity.

🗣️voice it. I appreciate it

[YorkshireBiker]

I can only speak from observation as the only woman I’ve tried to get into bed is my wife. I’m also generalising here too. 

It does seem to me that women have it much easier in terms of ‘getting laid’, most women  could walk out of the house, proclaim “I need a fuck” and 30 men will will crawl out random placed and form a queue. 

If the end goal is just a fuck , which a lot of these guys seem to be aiming for, then women to seem to have the advantage in this space. But I do wonder what calibre of men will be in that queue? Any decent ones that actually hold a conversation or keep you interested both physically and mentally?

If you fall into the category of men up who just want sex, you’re in a pool with many many other men and need to work really hard to stand out from the crowd. A dick pic, cute (but insulting) pet name, and how much you like your dick sucked isn’t standing out in the slightest.

But even if you do manage to stand out, what else do you have to offer? 

I personally agree in the sense I would enjoy receiving messages and being objectified over being ignored, but never having been in the position, I can’t say that wouldn’t get old real fast. The grass is always greener as they say.  

[lo****]

6 hours ago, Charlie218 said:

First of all I want to say and repeat that I’m generalizing here off course, I said that before.

Answering your statements here I go:
.
You don’t want us to be real, nobody would want that..
Any man being “real” would say or think: this girl look good I’d lie with her right away…
If we say so you all would run away and with all the rights of this world off course..
Furthermore I never generalized what woman wants, but how mostly man are dealt with in dating apps..

The elaborate and sophisticated bio go in second or third maybe grade of importance, bdsm is an exception, here is very important and everyone should do that accurately..
I’m talking more dating apps like tinder or Cupid that kind of things..

The real person btw come out with a lot of time getting to know each other, relating to each other..
.
I never said your profile is “basic” and I agree, as I already said, that people should read bio especially when bdsm is involved
.
Being ignored is the worst thing a human can experiment..
Recent born baby don’t die cause is treated bad, but cause is ignored (unlikely this experiment is real and has been conducted ).
I’m saying personally, I’d like 100 times more being objectified or being fetishized than being ignored.
So you don’t want to be ignored, nobody would want that.
The spooning things was just to say that woman has the possibility, not saying she would accept to spoon or to have sex lowering her standards, but at least you can have that, it’s not ideal but it’s something.

If a woman want a guy tomorrow to go to her house cause she feel into sex or bdsm she could get that in few hours chatting..
I could hardly say this could happen to any man..
A normal man In a normal situation have a very hard time to get laid.

I’m talking facts here, and I’m not against you or any woman at all, and not even saying man are poor victims of the society: I’m just acknowledging, I’ve done my research and I’ve been living things too.
I’m in an open relationship so something I can say I’ve been seen and leaving to rein*** my statements.

We are different, or biology is different, man instinctively want to join to as many woman he can for the sake of the species, and woman select the best mate for the sake and continuation of the species, and this is translated in the flirting process subconsciously…

There would be much more to say and would be beautiful debate more on human dynamics,I personally love it though I’m a very lazy typer ..

Every comment of yours I have read is giving me incel vibes.
THAT is such a HUGE turn off to women, and they don't seem to realize that mentality is EXACTLY what women are avoiding.

[CopperKnob]

7 hours ago, FatefulDestiny said:

You’re too old I’m afraid 😉

Ouch! 😂

[CopperKnob]

7 hours ago, FatefulDestiny said:

I think what he’s trying to say is that (many/some) men have low/no standards and will take whatever a woman offers. Whereas women are the opposite and all of this is defined by biology (and our ancestors) as opposed to anything else. 

Am I right?? 

Damn my biology, it's got a lot to answer for!

[ey****]

7 hours ago, YorkshireBiker said:

It does seem to me that women have it much easier in terms of ‘getting laid’, most women  could walk out of the house, proclaim “I need a fuck” and 30 men will will crawl out random placed and form a queue. 

 

the problem is the assumption this is the aim.    Because it's often the man's aim.

It's only 'easier' for women if safety and standards is ignored.  

Funnily enough.  I have known women who've gone through phases of quick hook ups - and, there were assorted problems they ran into.   For example how many people they might 'match' with only to find the other person just sets off god knows what vibes.   Or, that they match with and go to arrange something and the guy ghosts or no shows.   

That they do meet someone which was on the understanding it was a one-off fuck, and the guy pushed to do or meet again, which sometimes leads to stalking behaviour (I think it's tindr if you match with someone it's easy to find their facebook) 

This is before we get into how much is bad sex, poor hygiene, or any form of dangerous or threatening behaviour.

It's only really easier in a reality that doesn't exist.

Ironically, or not, it's why a lot of women into more casual / no strings sex tend to attend swinging clubs (advice often given to men looking for hook ups) or are understandably selective 

 

[Fa****]

4 hours ago, CopperKnob said:

Damn my biology, it's got a lot to answer for!

I know. Damn your biological father giving you the wrong chromosome. 

[CopperKnob]

2 hours ago, FatefulDestiny said:

I know. Damn your biological father giving you the wrong chromosome. 

It's the patriarchy I tell you!! 😂

[Kruntz]

Nothing written matters if you're not deemed attractive enough to the person you're trying to interact with.

I also dispute the idea you can't send vulgar messages, you 100% can - if you fall into the top category of attractivness. If you want to get more replies you're better off spending your *** on Tren than 'improving your personality". I'm not saying this applies to every single person but it applies to the significant majority.

[ge****]

1 hour ago, Kruntz said:

Nothing written matters if you're not deemed attractive enough to the person you're trying to interact with.

I also dispute the idea you can't send vulgar messages, you 100% can - if you fall into the top category of attractivness. If you want to get more replies you're better off spending your *** on Tren than 'improving your personality". I'm not saying this applies to every single person but it applies to the significant majority.

I'd disagree that the acceptability of vulgar messages increases with any level of attractiveness - the *only* person that deems if *any* message is acceptable or not is the recipient.
.
I'd also dispute that "nothing written matters if you're not deemed attractive enough" - I interact with all kinds of people on here, some who I am sure don't deem me attractive in that way, but who do, I believe, enjoy interacting with me.
.
Besides you've kind of contradicted yourself with your first two sentences - on the one hand you suggest that attraction is down to the recipient, and on the other you suggest a general sliding scale of attractiveness that those at the top of get carte blanche when it comes to what they write - it can't be both.
.
Welcome back by the way 🙂

[Kruntz]

9 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

I'd disagree that the acceptability of vulgar messages increases with any level of attractiveness - the *only* person that deems if *any* message is acceptable or not is the recipient.
.
I'd also dispute that "nothing written matters if you're not deemed attractive enough" - I interact with all kinds of people on here, some who I am sure don't deem me attractive in that way, but who do, I believe, enjoy interacting with me.
.
Besides you've kind of contradicted yourself with your first two sentences - on the one hand you suggest that attraction is down to the recipient, and on the other you suggest a general sliding scale of attractiveness that those at the top of get carte blanche when it comes to what they write - it can't be both.
.
Welcome back by the way 🙂

If you see some of the experiments that have been done, it will change your perception of reality and dating.

Thought I would give it another go here, we will see if it's any less of a time waste this time.

Edited May 16, 2023 by Kruntz

[ey****]

1 hour ago, Kruntz said:

I also dispute the idea you can't send vulgar messages, you 100% can - if you fall into the top category of attractivness.

for fucks sake, give it a rest

this is simply woe is me bollocks. 

[ey****]

2 minutes ago, Kruntz said:

If you see some of the experiments that have been done,

as I've cited above - most of the experiments are not actually done with proper data sampling and are merely cherry picked results.   Most tend not to be worth the paper they're written on or have assorted flaws and caveats if you actually look into them.

when it comes to giving anything 'another go' if you return with the same attitude and same arguments that failed last time, they will fail this time. 

[Kruntz]

1 minute ago, eyemblacksheep said:

as I've cited above - most of the experiments are not actually done with proper data sampling and are merely cherry picked results.   Most tend not to be worth the paper they're written on or have assorted flaws and caveats if you actually look into them.

when it comes to giving anything 'another go' if you return with the same attitude and same arguments that failed last time, they will fail this time. 

😂, this is gaslighting if I ever saw it. I'm not even making a moral judgment just stating reality, a reality experienced by most men who engage in some form of online dating. 

I actually match women on other platforms, even kink ones(feelD), though this place was always a waste of time for me.

[ey****]

3 minutes ago, Kruntz said:

I actually match women on other platforms, even kink ones(feelD), though this place was always a waste of time for me.

which leads to a question, and I mean this in total respect, honestly.

if you do well on some sites, and find others a waste of time - why use the ones which you feel are a waste of time? Especially if you're getting results you want elsewhere ?  

I just.  I dunno, I never understood the whole concept of giving things another go, if they're working elsewhere - and you're not changing tactics where things didn't work 

[ge****]

18 minutes ago, Kruntz said:

If you see some of the experiments that have been done, it will change your perception of reality and dating.

Thought I would give it another go here, we will see if it's any less of a time waste this time.

I don't need to see "experiments" to know what works and what my reality, and that of many other men that "get" it, is.
.
As for whether this is a waste of time, only you can decide, but a lot may depend on your expectations, attitude and approach - I wish you well with that.

[YorkshireBiker]

I’ve not been here long but I’d say long enough to know this isn’t Kinky Tinder.

Most of the people is see here are kinksters (not a real word apparently according to spell checker 😃) looking to chat to others in mostly civilised conversations; if your aim for this site is look for hook ups, then i would imagine you’ll be disappointed on a regular basis.  

[YorkshireBiker]

4 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

I don't need to see "experiments" to know what works and what my reality, and that of many other men that "get" it, is.
.
As for whether this is a waste of time, only you can decide, but a lot may depend on your expectations, attitude and approach - I wish you well with that.

I’ve not seen any experiments as such but I have seen interviews with self proclaimed high level women (whatever that means) and they have outright stated the difference between a creep and not a creep is the attractiveness of the man in question. 

There is some truth to it but I don’t know how much and how many interviews there are out there that say different. 

[Kruntz]

4 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

which leads to a question, and I mean this in total respect, honestly.

if you do well on some sites, and find others a waste of time - why use the ones which you feel are a waste of time? Especially if you're getting results you want elsewhere ?  

I just.  I dunno, I never understood the whole concept of giving things another go, if they're working elsewhere - and you're not changing tactics where things didn't work 

I assumed things can change but looking at the profiles it's the same people, same issues. To not acknowledge the nature of this environment is to give men a false sense of inadequacy and I'm not the only one saying this. If you want to get matches you're better off exercising, making *** and getting plastic surgery than anything else. 

[ge****]

9 minutes ago, YorkshireBiker said:

I’ve not seen any experiments as such but I have seen interviews with self proclaimed high level women (whatever that means) and they have outright stated the difference between a creep and not a creep is the attractiveness of the man in question. 

There is some truth to it but I don’t know how much and how many interviews there are out there that say different. 

Oh undoubtedly there are women out there who may see it that way, just as there are men who do, or who think they're owed something just for signing up to the site - but even if they do see it that way, attraction is a subjective thing that is down to individual taste just as it is for us mere mortals 😁
.
Ultimately though I'd take anything from any "self-proclaimed" people with a pinch of salt anyway, they're ultimately a minority really