Don’t Try to “Blow My Mind”

[wo****]

And opinions, by definition, are not facts you should be embarrassed by being so righteous with your ignorance

[wo****]

I asked you about your reporting of your experience and you became ***y instead of just replying.

I despise bigotry. I despise sexism. I despise lying. I often call it out when I see it. I do drone on and on but I don’t make claims that I pull out my ass and I am neither mean spirited nor sexist. Disagreeing with certain things certain women say is in no way shape or form bigoted.

[Ka****]

Wednesday at 09:54 PM, woburn169344 said:

I have never heard of a situation that happened where a man turned dangerous because when the woman doesn’t orgasm. I have heard of the trope saying that happens, never a report or recounting it actually happening though.

I understand that all sorts of wild and crazy things occasionally happen in all sorts of different situations but people usually don’t alter their approach to things because of a rare, one off type of occurrence they hear about. None of us know, but are you thinking it happens 1 out of 1000 times, 1 in 10,000 times a woman doesn’t orgasm the man becomes actually dangerous as a response, ?

What danger have you heard about a man bringing in an actual encounter that took place?

Also, the way I read and understand based upon what she actually states is

-whenever she explains she probably won’t cum
leads directly to
- the men make it their mission to make it happen

another way to state that, based on the way she says with her own words is

Every time (, not sometimes) I explain I probably won’t cum they make it their mission to make it happen.

* We don’t know what might happen, what or how much or how singular of a mission they may or may not see making her cum otherwise and it’s unfair to speculate since we don’t know them or her at all and don’t know the millions of possible tidbits of information they may have exchanged. We only have what she says in the op to go on.

Injecting various negative things men do or might do is every bit as wrong as injecting negative things women do or might do. We have what she says, that’s it.

She goes on to say that when it inevitably doesn’t happen she feels bad and also like her body is broken. We don’t know with any specificity what the various contributing factors may or may not be in stimulating her feeling bad and that her body is broken aside from the fact that it is directly linked to her not orgasming so it would be wrong and irresponsible to suggest it is or isn’t this thing or that thing, etc.

We literally have no idea because we don’t know anything about her. It could be any combination of any number of things. Pretending it is reasonable to lean towards one idea or possibility over another is wrong. It’s especially wrong if others jump in with agreement or claims they are reasonable in leaning in the other direction.

It’s wrong to assume it’s linked to the men and not just the not orgasming also. Because we have almost no information to go on. We have literally no idea whatsoever what is or isn’t involved and it’s quite possible she doesn’t know either. Putting one guess out there and not another is clear evidence that we favor that explanation over another. If the guess seems to make one party look bad and not the other we are starting to creep towards evidence of bigotry. It’s not proof of bigotry but if our posting history shows a clear pattern of putting one sex in a negative light and not the other… the evidence pointing to bigotry becomes stronger.

And if we say it could be A or B or C when all those things speak negatively about men in general or about these men none of us know WHILE OMITTING saying it could be just as likely be due to D or E or F that all speak negatively about women in general or the op in particular, OR the opposite saying ABC that makes women look bad while leaving out DEF that make men look bad and that kind of thing is a pattern for us…

It takes conscious and deliberate effort to become aware of our own biases and dedication to recognize it and refrain from using it or allowing it to influence us.

Biased thinking is a quick and dirty way to understand things. Careful consideration and effort to seek the truth without bias is a skill almost no one naturally develops. No one is perfect at it, but just like other skills, when yours is very well developed it doesn’t take any thought at all to recognize people who don’t have it or are rookies at it, etc.

Jesus Christ. Get over yourself. You have no idea the amount of *** and threats and danger that many women actually live with on a regular basis. And you clearly are more concerned with your comfort than the safety of women who encounter violent men.
Just stop.
*You* don’t know because you don’t experience life as a woman and in particular life as a woman who struggles to orgasm. And you choose not to listen and learn because you would rather challenge women with lived experiences. (Oh they didn’t say “I had this specific experience?” Maybe because that’s a much more emotionally difficult thing to say… but obviously saying it in exactly the right way that you retroactively say *you* need in order to understand is the most important thing, right?)
You are, however, serving as an excellent example of how bent out of shape men get when women have less than ideal experiences. And how demanding they get when we’ve agitated them by sharing our lives with them.
But my guess is that you have answers for all of that, right? Clearly, we need to be doing it better. If only we could all do everything exactly the way you said we should do it, then we would all be safe and happy. And if it goes poorly, we obviously didn’t do it the way you intended to say it and should have asked you for clarity, right? I’ve played that game enough in my life. It’s never good enough. No one can speak with the specificity and clarity that you demand - not even you.

[wo****]

1 hour ago, Kali_Baby said:

Jesus Christ. Get over yourself. You have no idea the amount of *** and threats and danger that many women actually live with on a regular basis. And you clearly are more concerned with your comfort than the safety of women who encounter violent men.
Just stop.
*You* don’t know because you don’t experience life as a woman and in particular life as a woman who struggles to orgasm. And you choose not to listen and learn because you would rather challenge women with lived experiences. (Oh they didn’t say “I had this specific experience?” Maybe because that’s a much more emotionally difficult thing to say… but obviously saying it in exactly the right way that you retroactively say *you* need in order to understand is the most important thing, right?)
You are, however, serving as an excellent example of how bent out of shape men get when women have less than ideal experiences. And how demanding they get when we’ve agitated them by sharing our lives with them.
But my guess is that you have answers for all of that, right? Clearly, we need to be doing it better. If only we could all do everything exactly the way you said we should do it, then we would all be safe and happy. And if it goes poorly, we obviously didn’t do it the way you intended to say it and should have asked you for clarity, right? I’ve played that game enough in my life. It’s never good enough. No one can speak with the specificity and clarity that you demand - not even you.

Your assumptions about me that you assert here are incorrect. I’m happy to walk through this entire thread and point to actual statements made, my interpretations based on what is said by others and my reasoning behind everything I said.
You criticize based on your own personal beliefs. I would take what you say seriously if you back up your claims by pointing to what I said in context and why your interpretation is a better way to understand my communication here than alternate ways.
If you are so confident go ahead and walk us through the details. I will do it also. Let people decide for themselves based on our reasoning. Walk us through it without cherry picking or making assumptions. Make me look bad by showing your work instead of using naked assertions. I dare you. I beg you.
Do you even know how or understand the flaws in your claims? Are you open to being shown how and why you are wrong? Based on what you say here I don’t think you are open to even considering you are wrong.
“Men bad, women victims” is always interesting to read in the various and creative ways it is communicated. Thanks

[wo****]

@Kali_ Baby said- You have no idea the amount of *** and threats and danger that many women actually live with on a regular basis.
Woburn says-
A.It is impossible for you to know whether I do or don’t.
B. Even if I didn’t it is besides the point. The op doesn’t ask about threats and danger and I don’t argue that that I know the amount and others don’t. No statistics about the amount were ever mentioned, so I certainly didn’t argue with any statistics.
C. Responsible adults back up their claims in a logical manner. Logic is a discipline of study. It’s similar to math in the sense that there are rules to how to solve math problems and you need to show your work. When someone understands those rules and the reasons behind why they matter and they look at other people’s assertions it is quite obvious when someone doesn’t understand.
It’s kind of like knowing a language and listening to others speak. If I am pretty fluent in French It’s obvious when someone speaks French. It’s also obvious to them when someone uses a French accent while speaking mostly English that they aren’t speaking French.

@Kali_Baby says-
And you clearly are more concerned with your comfort than the safety of women who encounter violent men.
Woburn says- That claim is something you pulled out of your ass. It is not reasonable to say that based on my communication in this thread. Believe it if you want but my posts in the thread don’t clearly or obviously show that at all. Adults back up their claims with reason, evidence, and logic when their assertions are challenged. It’s your claim, back it up and open up your argument to scrutiny to demonstrate it’s true and not your personal speculation.

@Kali_Baby says *You* don’t know because you don’t experience life as a woman and in particular life as a woman who struggles to orgasm.
Woburn says- So you’re building off of your last speculative assumption and adding this in? It’s a misguided belief, using very charitable language.
Watch, I will show a bit of my work to show it’s not fact- lots of women would disagree with your assertion.
- Many women will have a lot of different interpretations than you do despite them all living life as a women. I think reasonable people will acknowledge that and understand it as an obvious truth. I could be wrong though. Maybe all women see it the same way you do.
- Claiming that people can’t know and understand things that happen in the world because they are not the same sex as the people it happens to is obviously a false claim. For example
- Female physicians can’t know and understand things that go on with men’s reproductive organs because they don’t live life as a man. Really?

@Kali_Baby says: you choose not to listen and learn because you would rather challenge women with lived experiences:
Woburn says: I think I’m a pretty good listener. I often learn things by doing so. But sometimes I listen but don’t agree with what is said. My lived experience is that people sometimes disagree. If I disagree I am willing to show why and listen to feedback explaining why I am wrong. Others aren’t. People using an ideology to understand people are often unwilling to consider things that contradict with their ideology. It’s a close minded approach. They know they are right because they form their belief based on what the ideology says. Their mind isn’t open to other ways of looking at it. Maybe I’m way off base here too. At least I show some of my thoughts on the issue. I uses words like “often” to show I am not making a claim about what always happens. I use some detail explaining my take on adherents to an ideology, but I show that I am open to the possibility of being wrong.

@Kali_Baby says: they didn’t say “I had this specific experience?” Maybe because that’s a much more emotionally difficult thing to say…
Woburn says: I agree that what you say here is certainly a possibility. But you are leaving a lot out. More was said, context isn’t included, and there are other possible explanations also. I asked fair and reasonable questions. I shared some of my thoughts without making accusations. My questions were not answered. I didn’t claim to know, I asked for clarification and perspective. In response I believe I summarized what was said in response something like “instead of just answering the questions you got all ***y”. I wasn’t all ***y to them. Your subjective view may be different than mine. I am willing to explain my reasoning for all to see. You are not. That says something. What it says is open to interpretation, but it says something.

@Kali_Baby says: obviously saying it in exactly the right way that you retroactively say *you* need in order to understand is the most important thing, right?)
Woburn says: That’s your perspective. It is neither fair nor accurate as to what actually was communicated in the back and forth referred to just above. I am willing to explain why if you explain why it is fair and accurate and open your explanation to receive feedback pointing to why you are wrong. It’s another claim. My understanding is you are unwilling to explain yourself, to show why your take is on point while looking at it within context. That’s fine with me. I am saying all this understanding others will read it.
It also demonstrates good faith and an invitation to show why I am wrong, along with showing I am open to the possibility of being wrong. It’s pretty clear to me what your views are.

@Kali_Baby says: You are, however, serving as an excellent example of how bent out of shape men get when women have less than ideal experiences.
Woburn says: I’ve made my point. I might come back to say more in another post, not sure. ——————

[th****]

I’d love to send you a message but I’m not able too. I’d love to chat sometime. I understand a lot of what you are saying. People don’t understand that things need a build up. Foreplay is a very important part. Especially for the fairer sex. Send me a message if you’d like to chat some more. You’re not broken.