How much is too much "training"?

[ey****]

basically. ongoing communication

the answer is dependent on the sub - and so ongoing talks at neutral times about where you are and where you want to go.  The ongoing chats keep you both on the right direction.    

The main thing also of course is - to work on an environment where there is no real consequence for saying no.  Even if you are taking them outside of their typical comfort zones. Consequence doesn't mean you'll punish them for saying no, but it can be anywhere from them feeling pressured or stuck.   

[si****]

In my opinion coercive or manipulative behaviour is not ethically acceptable. Consent cannot be obtained through manipulation or ***. This discussion needs to be outside of the dynamic so that they do not feel under pressure to say yes.

The scope of the dynamic should be agreed and clearly understood and all changes should be outside of it.

If the outcome is "willing to try," that should come with explicit boundaries: pace, control, a safeword that applies equally (the Dom can use it too, that's important), and a debrief afterward.

[Bi****]

Yea having a sub is about making them feel safe in the whole dynamic. It's not really at all about your needs. You need to talk to them about it and what they're comfortable with.

[Ro****]

From a solo poly sub POV, First discuss with her. Find out if they areeven in the slightest interested in a small facet of it. If she says hard no, respect that.

Also keep in mind what one may classify as one thing, another may classify as something else. For example, spitting in your sub mouth may be considered *** to someone who enjoys *** in general but to another who does not particularly like ***, may consider it as a more of a small act to please, that they allow in conjunction with praise, if they know it turns the dom on. Understand them and their stance.

Important thing is communication with them.

[an****]

4 hours ago, si-whiz said:

In my opinion coercive or manipulative behaviour is not ethically acceptable. Consent cannot be obtained through manipulation or ***. This discussion needs to be outside of the dynamic so that they do not feel under pressure to say yes.

The scope of the dynamic should be agreed and clearly understood and all changes should be outside of it.

If the outcome is "willing to try," that should come with explicit boundaries: pace, control, a safeword that applies equally (the Dom can use it too, that's important), and a debrief afterward.

Exactly, all major communication should be complete outside the dynamic where sub/dom is out of play and everything is equal human to human discussion. I will go further to say safe word use is a failure of control. At no point should a sub have to be required to take control during the dynamic. That dismantles the entire system. Safe words exist because safety is more important than ego and consent is non-negotiable. However, and I will direct quote because I can't say it better "the scope of the dynamic should be agreed and clearly understood and all changes should be outside of it", no the sub does not control the dynamic, this is a misleading and confusing idea to spread in this community and is in exact conflict with submission.

[Da****]

A positive dynamic is sharing the thrill and fun of meeting each other's needs both Dom and Sub being able to feel comfortable & safe to express each other's deepest desires, neither feeling judged, but essential neither feeling pressured in any way to be a kink dispenser. If she is open-minded but nervous about trying this cuckquean fantasy with you it may be a soft limit where you can talk about it together over time and share it if she becomes genuinely excited and enthusiastic about it with safe word and understanding of what she may feel any anxiety about can be expressed at any time including stopping at any time of course. If it is a hard limit then it must be respected and is a question of if both content with overall balance of needs and desires with a dynamic/relationship being aligned in a positive way for each of you or not. Honesty, respect, non-judgement, and consent should see you both right 🙏🏼✨

[PL****]

From a sub perspective, I think you are definitely asking the right questions. I also agree with all the comments about asking and discussing when not in the dynamic. I have had a few don perspectives that think that once in the dynamic, they set the tone and if they want to do different then previously discussed that's okay because they are now in control and once I'm in my subspace it's difficult for me to object. Therefore, they violate the consent that was given. In fact this occured not too long ago with a perspective dom and when I told him he violated my consent after, he got very angry and even implied it was an SA. However, it wasn't. I simply identified that he had chosen to go outside of agreed upon terms and that is a *** of my consent. The problem I was in subspace. The goal (for me) is to not have to think, not have to worry, not have to fe@@r nbsp;or distrust. This is achieved when we make a plan prior and stick to it, as us the case for most subs who are within these types of dynamics. So the biggest piece of advice I can give is listen to your sub in and out of the dynamic. Have those conversations when she/he isn't in their subspace, because doms teain us to listen and obey when we are in subspace. That training especially if you have been trained well even by others in the past sticks. And it takes a lot to get unstuck.

[an****]

3 hours ago, PLEASEandTEASEme said:

From a sub perspective, I think you are definitely asking the right questions. I also agree with all the comments about asking and discussing when not in the dynamic. I have had a few don perspectives that think that once in the dynamic, they set the tone and if they want to do different then previously discussed that's okay because they are now in control and once I'm in my subspace it's difficult for me to object. Therefore, they violate the consent that was given. In fact this occured not too long ago with a perspective dom and when I told him he violated my consent after, he got very angry and even implied it was an SA. However, it wasn't. I simply identified that he had chosen to go outside of agreed upon terms and that is a *** of my consent. The problem I was in subspace. The goal (for me) is to not have to think, not have to worry, not have to fe@@r nbsp;or distrust. This is achieved when we make a plan prior and stick to it, as us the case for most subs who are within these types of dynamics. So the biggest piece of advice I can give is listen to your sub in and out of the dynamic. Have those conversations when she/he isn't in their subspace, because doms teain us to listen and obey when we are in subspace. That training especially if you have been trained well even by others in the past sticks. And it takes a lot to get unstuck.

Thank you for this. Exactly. It is ten times more important for a dom to check in with themselves during dynamic. Like a DD designated dom 🤣 with a 'drunk' sub (in-play).

[Co****]

as a domme, my subs needs are more important than my wants

[Co****]

their need for safety and security in edge play vs my want to cuck someone out when they’re not naturally into that , risking traumatizing them , fetishes are usually but not always genetic and yes that means ur family members might be into the same stuff lmao sorry 😅😩

[er****]

To be clear on this, you should 100% have a contractual conversation about both you and the submissives wants, needs, limits, and expectations. And if it's a limit and you're in a "normal D/s dynamic, then yes, pushing it IS co@rcion. Now, if you were in a TPE(Total Power exchange) dynamic, then the situation is different. Part of a TPE dynamic is an understanding that your limits are going to be pushed. But understand most are not up for the type of dedication required for that level of D/s. so I reiterate, having that intro conversation and finding out if cuckoldry is on the table at all is your best odds of success. That or find a poly partner who is good at pretending and likes to watch.

[er****]

21 hours ago, CobraCummander said:

their need for safety and security in edge play vs my want to cuck someone out when they’re not naturally into that , risking traumatizing them , fetishes are usually but not always genetic and yes that means ur family members might be into the same stuff lmao sorry 😅😩

100% disagreed lol my family are all a bunch of missionary only prudes, I've had indepth conversations with all of my immediate family(sort of hard to avoid that when your partner calls you Sir and Master all the time xD) about my dynamic and lifestyle since I actively work to maintain open communication about such. I'm curious where you heared that from. I would be interested to read/hear more about that theory. It sounds like it originates from Freudian theories.

[cu****]

I think the fact you’re aware and mindful is admirable personally. I think submissive’s inherently want to please and yes will try things they wouldn’t normally but that’s not necessarily a bad thing, how else do we learn likes and dislikes, hard and soft limits, how to improve something, etc? We also have the personal responsibility of saying no to something we’re not interested in on any level and the expectation that it’ll be honored as a boundary, which comes down to open honest transparent communication.

You can train all you like (with consent) but if something isn’t for them then it just isn’t for them and I’d say if there isn’t enthusiastic consent or clear satisfaction in the mix then it’s going too far. If this is a need for you then maybe seek out someone who shares that same interest?