So, You Violated Someones Consent?

[CopperKnob]

What to do in four easy steps. Okay, not so easy.

Step One

There can be no meaningful statement of contrition if you think “sorry” is the apology. “Sorry” is for eating the last of the icecream (rude!), not a consent ***. If you’ve violated consent, your remorse is supposed to be an indicator for the meaningful change you’re about to work towards accomplishing. Your community aren’t looking for someone who kinda, sorta feels bad about it. They need to know that you’re going to stop harming people.

Step Two

If you don’t define your wrong accurately, we can conclude you’re not aware of your wrong and therefore can’t change it. If you used a bull whip instead of the agreed paddle for example, don’t rephrase it so it sounds prettier than it really was, or you might as well not apologise at all.

Don’t rationalise it. That makes any hope of change a moot point
Don’t minimise it. That tells us you don’t think you did much wrong.
Don’t justify it. If you do, we will know that you see no reason to change.

Step Three

Most consent violators follow with “yes, but.” Yes, but the other person was supposed to… Yes, but I didn’t… Yes, but it wasn’t me. It was Colonel Mustard in the Library with the lead pipe.

You cannot blame others while simultaneously taking responsibility for a grave error that caused harm.

Step Four

You cannot dictate how someone you’ve harmed should behave now that you’ve spent 10 minutes contemplating your navel, I mean matters.

You do not get to decide if you should be allowed back at events.
You don’t get to tell the person/s you harmed that they should stop being angry now. Those emotions are part of healing.
You’re actually not entitled to a damn thing from them, but they’re certainly entitled to their feelings.

I can hear the “buts” rolling into this post already. But “sorry” should be enough. But I shouldn’t have to put my dignity/pride/indignation away. But you should forgive me. But everyone fucks up.

But, you are the one looking to use glue to put Humpty Dumpty back together again and “sorry” won’t achieve it, not when all the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't achieve it. Only making sure you do everything necessary to help the other party to recover in every way possible will amend this. If you don’t want to fix it, then you shouldn’t be apologising.

But I guess then you might have to deal with the consequences of your actions. And maybe that, right there, is why you’re bothering with an apology in the first place: not to heal the other person, but to regain your social freedom. Yeah. That’s not amends my friend. It’s manipulation.

[Sophie58]

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

[na****]

Another great, informative post. Very well said CopperKnob 💖

[Fishbicycle]

Hope you’re ok!
I used this analogy with my kids, it makes it simple I think in a nilla setting however ours complicates it but I would hope we’re grown up enough to understand it and more so apply it!

A mother finds out that her child has bullied other ***.
The mother says:
"Pick up that glass". The child does.
"Throw it on the floor"
The glass smashes into pieces.
"Now say sorry to it".
The child asks "why?"
Mum says "just do it".
The child says, "sorry".
The mum says, "is it back together as one piece?"
The child says, "No Mum."
The mum says "some things cannot always be fixed by saying sorry.
Remember this next time you hurt someone either physically or mentally."
Wrong choices can equal bad memories that last, the right choices can make amazing memories that last forever!!

[CopperKnob]

50 minutes ago, Sophie58 said:

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

Thats a HUGE *** and not OK! I agree it says a lot about the other individuals and their safety. Fingers crossed for you and the results x

[BadDesires]

2 hours ago, Sophie58 said:

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

Hope you're ok. This is shocking behaviour and you shouldn't have been ***d into this situation. You have every right to stick to your guns if you are being violated although I can also understand why it would be challenging. The stress, worry and consequences of this are not something they should have put you through. On reflection do you feel you would let things play out the same in a similar situation or do you think you would be stronger in the moment?

[TheBookCollector]

Great writting as usual.

For me step one is actually acceptance and taking ownership of the consent ***. Until that happens nothing else can.

Then comes the meaningful contrition and apology.

[Sophie58]

2 hours ago, BadDesires said:

Hope you're ok. This is shocking behaviour and you shouldn't have been ***d into this situation. You have every right to stick to your guns if you are being violated although I can also understand why it would be challenging. The stress, worry and consequences of this are not something they should have put you through. On reflection do you feel you would let things play out the same in a similar situation or do you think you would be stronger in the moment?

I really really need to be careful who I let to be physically near me. I trust too easily so I need to draw the line early. I know my nature is to accommodate In the actual moment, so for me, I’ve got to really protect the line of in person engagement and say no early.

[TheBookCollector]

4 hours ago, Sophie58 said:

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

I am extremely sad this happened to you.

Sadly its an all too frequent occuance or the cunning ones put on a condom to placte the remove it mid way through so the woman doesnt realise whats happened.

I hope your tests come back negative.

[Sophie58]

4 hours ago, TheBookCollector said:

I am extremely sad this happened to you.

Sadly its an all too frequent occuance or the cunning ones put on a condom to placte the remove it mid way through so the woman doesnt realise whats happened.

I hope your tests come back negative.

Thank you book man, I appreciate it. Sadly it does happen very easily. I’m sure I’ll be ok. It’s a learning experience

[Je****]

9 hours ago, Sophie58 said:

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

Im sorry but this is not ok. 

If they agreed to but didnt use... or removed a condom half way through the act without youre knowledge or consent this is assult and can be legally challenged and reported. 

This should never have happened to you.  I hope everything turned out ok

[Sophie58]

18 minutes ago, JenniferTP said:

Im sorry but this is not ok. 

If they agreed to but didnt use... or removed a condom half way through the act without youre knowledge or consent this is assult and can be legally challenged and reported. 

This should never have happened to you.  I hope everything turned out ok

Thank you Jennifer, so many guys are just plain selfish.

[Sophie58]

Sorry CopperKnob, didn’t mean to make this about me. Such a vital tenant for a sub is absolute trust. The *** of consent sends us back light years. I’ve worked soooo hard to find people I can trust. The list keeps getting shorter. Due to your coaching, I now also consider my pussy to be Fort Knox. Thanks for that empowerment!

[CopperKnob]

3 hours ago, Sophie58 said:

Sorry CopperKnob, didn’t mean to make this about me. Such a vital tenant for a sub is absolute trust. The *** of consent sends us back light years. I’ve worked soooo hard to find people I can trust. The list keeps getting shorter. Due to your coaching, I now also consider my pussy to be Fort Knox. Thanks for that empowerment!

Not at all! I can't believe what you're going through, my head would be all over the place. I have everything crossed for you

[Sophie58]

32 minutes ago, CopperKnob said:

Not at all! I can't believe what you're going through, my head would be all over the place. I have everything crossed for you

Thanks Hon! I can’t message you so I sent you a gift as a thank you for all you do for our community. You’re a blessing!

[4R****]

16 hours ago, Fishbicycle said:

Hope you’re ok!
I used this analogy with my kids, it makes it simple I think in a nilla setting however ours complicates it but I would hope we’re grown up enough to understand it and more so apply it!

A mother finds out that her child has bullied other ***.
The mother says:
"Pick up that glass". The child does.
"Throw it on the floor"
The glass smashes into pieces.
"Now say sorry to it".
The child asks "why?"
Mum says "just do it".
The child says, "sorry".
The mum says, "is it back together as one piece?"
The child says, "No Mum."
The mum says "some things cannot always be fixed by saying sorry.
Remember this next time you hurt someone either physically or mentally."
Wrong choices can equal bad memories that last, the right choices can make amazing memories that last forever!!

Stealing this. There's someone I need to teach this exact lesson to!

[4R****]

7 hours ago, Sophie58 said:

Sorry CopperKnob, didn’t mean to make this about me. Such a vital tenant for a sub is absolute trust. The *** of consent sends us back light years. I’ve worked soooo hard to find people I can trust. The list keeps getting shorter. Due to your coaching, I now also consider my pussy to be Fort Knox. Thanks for that empowerment!

Sorry to read about what's happened to you and I'm taking nothing away from your experience when I say what I'm about to say. When we hear of consent ***s and breaches of trust we automatically think poor sub and bad Dom. But trust is vital on both sides of the slash and likewise violators can sit on either side of the slash too. I've never been anything other than on the left hand side of the slash but I've had my consent violated many times over the years. Likewise I've had my trust broken multiple times too. @CopperKnob this is a brilliant post and kudos for the way it's written. @Sophie58, you're dead right about the ever shrinking list of people that can be trusted. And when new people come along, it's way harder to build trust when you see little things that remind you of those who have come (and gone) before them.

[CopperKnob]

21 minutes ago, SirArchA said:

Sorry to read about what's happened to you and I'm taking nothing away from your experience when I say what I'm about to say. When we hear of consent ***s and breaches of trust we automatically think poor sub and bad Dom. But trust is vital on both sides of the slash and likewise violators can sit on either side of the slash too. I've never been anything other than on the left hand side of the slash but I've had my consent violated many times over the years. Likewise I've had my trust broken multiple times too. @CopperKnob this is a brilliant post and kudos for the way it's written. @Sophie58, you're dead right about the ever shrinking list of people that can be trusted. And when new people come along, it's way harder to build trust when you see little things that remind you of those who have come (and gone) before them.

Exactly this. I don't think it's a question of will someone/I violate consent more, when will they/I. Because, when we consider everyday comparators, we all do it, all the time and a lot of the time we accept it and let it go. But, it's about the aftermath.

[Sophie58]

2 hours ago, SirArchA said:

Sorry to read about what's happened to you and I'm taking nothing away from your experience when I say what I'm about to say. When we hear of consent ***s and breaches of trust we automatically think poor sub and bad Dom. But trust is vital on both sides of the slash and likewise violators can sit on either side of the slash too. I've never been anything other than on the left hand side of the slash but I've had my consent violated many times over the years. Likewise I've had my trust broken multiple times too. @CopperKnob this is a brilliant post and kudos for the way it's written. @Sophie58, you're dead right about the ever shrinking list of people that can be trusted. And when new people come along, it's way harder to build trust when you see little things that remind you of those who have come (and gone) before them.

So trust, and betrayal of trust are not unique to us… all relationships struggle with it on both sides. It’s just, for us, the consequences can be much higher, on both sides, because we both enter into such an high level of vulnerability. I don’t for a second think the sub is more *** than the Dom, in a true D/s relationship. IMO, we equally share power and vulnerability, just in different ways.

So I keep leaning in, looking for those treasures I can trust, doing me best to protect myself, and learning from my mistakes, because dear True Doms, you are worth it.

[4R****]

30 minutes ago, Sophie58 said:

So trust, and betrayal of trust are not unique to us… all relationships struggle with it on both sides. It’s just, for us, the consequences can be much higher, on both sides, because we both enter into such an high level of vulnerability. I don’t for a second think the sub is more *** than the Dom, in a true D/s relationship. IMO, we equally share power and vulnerability, just in different ways.

So I keep leaning in, looking for those treasures I can trust, doing me best to protect myself, and learning from my mistakes, because dear True Doms, you are worth it.

And that is all we can do, protect ourselves, learn from experiences and grow. You are right, we share in different ways, bottoms have a vulnerability because they give up control, put themselves at risk of harm, perhaps as simple as a mis-delivered stroke of a cane, too tight a tie or more serious such as what you have described or other consent ***s. The Top on the other hand has risks in other ways. For example, a scene doesn't go the way the bottom expected it to, so she complains to her friends about the bad experience with Dom Y. People talk, the next thing is a rumour going around that Dom Y has done something wrong in a scene. Or perhaps following a CNC scene, the bottom gets buyer's remorse and complains. Or perhaps someone decides they are going to report the bruises they recieved. The risk the Top is taking is that it is them that controlled the scene. It's them that was the perpetrator in the CNC scene. It's them that committed Actual Bodily Harm in order to deliver the strokes that left the bruises. Unfortunately in these situations, if they are investigated, things will go south very quickly for the Top. This is why trust is so important on both sides. Vetting is imperative. Many people don't think about the risks that the Top takes until it's too late.

[Sophie58]

16 minutes ago, SirArchA said:

And that is all we can do, protect ourselves, learn from experiences and grow. You are right, we share in different ways, bottoms have a vulnerability because they give up control, put themselves at risk of harm, perhaps as simple as a mis-delivered stroke of a cane, too tight a tie or more serious such as what you have described or other consent ***s. The Top on the other hand has risks in other ways. For example, a scene doesn't go the way the bottom expected it to, so she complains to her friends about the bad experience with Dom Y. People talk, the next thing is a rumour going around that Dom Y has done something wrong in a scene. Or perhaps following a CNC scene, the bottom gets buyer's remorse and complains. Or perhaps someone decides they are going to report the bruises they recieved. The risk the Top is taking is that it is them that controlled the scene. It's them that was the perpetrator in the CNC scene. It's them that committed Actual Bodily Harm in order to deliver the strokes that left the bruises. Unfortunately in these situations, if they are investigated, things will go south very quickly for the Top. This is why trust is so important on both sides. Vetting is imperative. Many people don't think about the risks that the Top takes until it's too late.

Dang… ouch! You’re right that the Dom takes more legal risks and I’m so sorry if you’ve experienced unfair treatment. As a sub, my feeling of protection for the Dom should be just as high as his protection of me. One encounter I had left me looking like I had been hit by a truck I was sooooo bruised. I bitched at the guy for not bringing a condom… not for the bruises because that part was fun and it was absolutely consensual. What a hypocrite I would be to later blame him. Subs also need to take responsibility for their choices. I wish you well SirArchA and hope you have some trustworthy subs to play with.

[4R****]

6 minutes ago, Sophie58 said:

Dang… ouch! You’re right that the Dom takes more legal risks and I’m so sorry if you’ve experienced unfair treatment. As a sub, my feeling of protection for the Dom should be just as high as his protection of me. One encounter I had left me looking like I had been hit by a truck I was sooooo bruised. I bitched at the guy for not bringing a condom… not for the bruises because that part was fun and it was absolutely consensual. What a hypocrite I would be to later blame him. Subs also need to take responsibility for their choices. I wish you well SirArchA and hope you have some trustworthy subs to play with.

Thankfully those were just examples but I have been on the receiving end of buyers remorse a couple of times. Thankfully I have a good circle around me and a decent reputation and so it was seen for what it was. However I have seen some very good Doms lose their reputation over

[4R****]

8 minutes ago, Sophie58 said:

Dang… ouch! You’re right that the Dom takes more legal risks and I’m so sorry if you’ve experienced unfair treatment. As a sub, my feeling of protection for the Dom should be just as high as his protection of me. One encounter I had left me looking like I had been hit by a truck I was sooooo bruised. I bitched at the guy for not bringing a condom… not for the bruises because that part was fun and it was absolutely consensual. What a hypocrite I would be to later blame him. Subs also need to take responsibility for their choices. I wish you well SirArchA and hope you have some trustworthy subs to play with.

Oops posted before I'd finished typing..... over the wrong thing being said to the wrong person. I wish you well too Sophie58, and hope your trusted list starts to grow again soon 😊

[na****]

Great topic guys. Very intriguing 🥰

[Deleted Member]

Yesterday at 04:56 AM, Sophie58 said:

Ouch intense CK, this feels a bit personal… I hope you are ok 😘🤗
My latest seems benign… two men overrode my ask for a condom. Ok it’s hard for a sub to stick to her guns when in the moment. It’s an indicator of the guy when he overrides. So I’m back to another month waiting to get my next clean STI/STD tests. I don’t think it comes close to what you’re talking about, but it’s still for me a lack of consent and I’m sorry doesn’t cut it (not that they apologized)

I’m so sorry you were taken advantage of in that way, that’s fucking awful to put it bluntly. I really hope your results are clear and your boundaries are respected more in future events.
I’ve noticed a few posts on the forum recently about consent, boundaries being crossed, threats of revenge porn after relationships have ended and while none of it really surprises me, it does upset me. I wish more Dom’s understood the impact of the harm this can do to any S type and their future relationships. Thankyou for sharing this 💙