Being Dumb over Icebreakers

[Si****]

I might try using the following opening messages for fun.

" Don't look at my profile, if you do, keep your eyes closed. You might not like what I have written. There is a very slim chance you might, but lets not take the risk. Best all round if you just stand and stare at the toaster. We only get one shot at life and its best not to spend too much time reading something that might not even be real. I might just be a cat that has learned how to use a keyboard. One never knows. I see in your profile you like ***********. Wow I might like that too, but best not find out. Its too risky and time consuming, much quicker to just block people without finding out anything."

[helenOfToy]

What really puts me off is when I get a one line message from someone who has been on the site two hours and has already messaged 30 people. That just strikes me as throwing messages against the wall to see what sticks...

[ey****]

33 minutes ago, Paul_aka_Helen said:

What really puts me off is when I get a one line message from someone who has been on the site two hours and has already messaged 30 people. That just strikes me as throwing messages against the wall to see what sticks...

yep - and it's like - we see you do it

you're not interested in *me* you're interested in *anything* 

[helenOfToy]

1 hour ago, eyemblacksheep said:

yep - and it's like - we see you do it

you're not interested in *me* you're interested in *anything* 

Absolutely so. I'm far more likely to respond to someone who's either been around a while, or who at least makes an effort to catch my attention (and has actually read my profile).

Questions like:

"what are you looking for?" - read my profile

"where are you?" - read my profile

"are you a man or a woman?"" - ffs read my profile!

get very boring very quickly.

I even say in my profile "try to say something more interesting than 'hi sexy'".

[Deleted Member]

4 hours ago, Bounty said:

It's not that people start with things that are mundane, that's not the point. It's when they expect you to be collared, submitting to them within three sentences... and if we don't leap at the chance we're the bad guys.

In the last couple of weeks 75 pc of my messages have been along the lines of "hey slut, u r hot. U r mine now"

Or "let's meet"

Yeah, I wasn't really talking about messages like these.

 

  

3 hours ago, SirGreen said:

" Don't look at my profile, if you do, keep your eyes closed. You might not like what I have written. There is a very slim chance you might, but lets not take the risk. Best all round if you just stand and stare at the toaster. We only get one shot at life and its best not to spend too much time reading something that might not even be real. I might just be a cat that has learned how to use a keyboard. One never knows. I see in your profile you like ***********. Wow I might like that too, but best not find out. Its too risky and time consuming, much quicker to just block people without finding out anything."

That's funny.

 

43 minutes ago, Paul_aka_Helen said:

"what are you looking for?" - read my profile

I might personally ask that question if it was only vaguely mentioned in their profile and I was looking for more detail. See it depends on the context however "read my profile" could be pretty dismissive.

[Phoenyx]

I just happened to have an exchange along this line, a couple days ago.  A lady who was somewhat "local" (that's a mere three-hour drive in this neck of the woods) messaged me with a simple, "Hello".  Now, I will say, that I have already found someone on this list, with whom I have become quite serious.  But, because this new lady was nearby,  and because she had an extensive list of kinks on her profile, I decided to respond, just to satisfy my own curiosity.  Perhaps, she could be a contact, to any nearby "Scenes".  This "Bible Belt" desert is quite a dead-zone.

Sometime back, this list had quite a discussion, on the best way for potential subs to approach Doms or Dominas.  Nevertheless, the response that I got from this particular lady, reminded me more of Bugs Bunny: "Aaaaaa, (munch, munch, munch) What's up Doc?"  There was nothing in her tone, to catch my interest.

Now, I tried to be diplomatic.  I did mention that I was already "seeing" someone.  But, I also tried to offer advice, on a better approach.  Once again, I was trying to get the word out, that these "Hello" messages just aren't having the desired effect.  Perhaps, I have been a Dom too long.  My "advice" may have been a bit too "hard-line".  It seemed to be taken as an insult.  Yet, it was never meant that way.

Now that I think about it, the problem may be this new, all-electronic format.  We are in uncharted territory.  Much has been said about the "traditions" of initial interactions in the BDSM scene.  But, such traditional "middle-ground" greetings have always been based upon eye-contact and body language.  We do not have that, in this new text-only format.  So far, in text-only, there are only the two extremes---either "What's up Doc?", or total supplication and the usage of titles.  Both of those approaches have been equally rebuked.  There is no traditional "middle-ground", in electronica.  At least, not yet.  So, perhaps, our discussion needs to begin there.

[Deleted Member]

11 hours ago, Curvykate said:

Chief, you’re not single for a start. I think that would be a factor for many. And the missing profile photo - many don’t even accept messages from people who haven’t added one (I don’t) There is nothing personal in your profile. Just that you want a sub. Nothing about what kind of Dom you are, other interests, why you’re seeking someone when you’re not single. If people are rude or block in return, that is unnecessary if you’ve been polite in your approach. But if you’re not getting responses - there are reasons.

#1 I've tried adding pics for my profile and they get rejected. Face pics included. #2 Relationship status is what it is. There are MANY others here because their significant other isn't into the same thing. #3 There's not a lot in my profile because I'm changing it. But thank you so much for your judgement.

[Deleted Member]

45 minutes ago, phoenyx said:

I just happened to have an exchange along this line, a couple days ago.  A lady who was somewhat "local" (that's a mere three-hour drive in this neck of the woods) messaged me with a simple, "Hello".  Now, I will say, that I have already found someone on this list, with whom I have become quite serious.  But, because this new lady was nearby,  and because she had an extensive list of kinks on her profile, I decided to respond, just to satisfy my own curiosity.  Perhaps, she could be a contact, to any nearby "Scenes".  This "Bible Belt" desert is quite a dead-zone.

Sometime back, this list had quite a discussion, on the best way for potential subs to approach Doms or Dominas.  Nevertheless, the response that I got from this particular lady, reminded me more of Bugs Bunny: "Aaaaaa, (munch, munch, munch) What's up Doc?"  There was nothing in her tone, to catch my interest.

Now, I tried to be diplomatic.  I did mention that I was already "seeing" someone.  But, I also tried to offer advice, on a better approach.  Once again, I was trying to get the word out, that these "Hello" messages just aren't having the desired effect.  Perhaps, I have been a Dom too long.  My "advice" may have been a bit too "hard-line".  It seemed to be taken as an insult.  Yet, it was never meant that way.

See, that kind of response is totally legit as you both checked out her profile and then hung around to see if she had any value. Most people don't really like advice but I'm not seriously gonna fault that. I don't think that's "being dumb over ice breakers": it's an authentic and well-reasoned approach.

 

Quote

Now that I think about it, the problem may be this new, all-electronic format.  We are in uncharted territory.  Much has been said about the "traditions" of initial interactions in the BDSM scene.  But, such traditional "middle-ground" greetings have always been based upon eye-contact and body language.  We do not have that, in this new text-only format.  So far, in text-only, there are only the two extremes---either "What's up Doc?", or total supplication and the usage of titles.  Both of those approaches have been equally rebuked.  There is no traditional "middle-ground", in electronica.  At least, not yet.  So, perhaps, our discussion needs to begin there.

I don't think it's going to improve much as people's natural instinct is to expend as little energy as possible. It goes back to the cave men see - we'd mostly sleep, mate, eat or kill/hunt. Everything else that wasn't survival related was a wasted expenditure. It's just a shame that kind of survival mentality doesn't really have much relevance to a technologically sophisticated society where urban adaptation actually means staying on top of many different, non-strictly survival related skills.

[Phoenyx]

1 hour ago, BlushingFlush said:

I don't think it's going to improve much as people's natural instinct is to expend as little energy as possible. It goes back to the cave men see - we'd mostly sleep, mate, eat or kill/hunt. Everything else that wasn't survival related was a wasted expenditure. It's just a shame that kind of survival mentality doesn't really have much relevance to a technologically sophisticated society where urban adaptation actually means staying on top of many different, non-strictly survival related skills.

Excellent starting point.  It is also true though, that folks will also expend whatever effort that they deem necessary, to achieve the results that they desire.  So, how do we put into words, the simple opening message expressed by eye-contact and body language?  As you pointed-out, it needs to be short and basic.

[Nylon-Nellie]

5 hours ago, Paul_aka_Helen said:

Absolutely so. I'm far more likely to respond to someone who's either been around a while, or who at least makes an effort to catch my attention (and has actually read my profile).

Questions like:

"what are you looking for?" - read my profile

"where are you?" - read my profile

"are you a man or a woman?"" - ffs read my profile!

get very boring very quickly.

I even say in my profile "try to say something more interesting than 'hi sexy'".

This made me laugh, certainly does ring a bell or two with me.

[Nylon-Nellie]

9 hours ago, SirGreen said:

The lack of a picture could be a reason.

Photos always helps. Cannot be doing with messaging someone with no half decent photo on their profile and then they expect the female to have a plethora of photos up.

[Nylon-Nellie]

@ChiefNexus Ask why your photos have been rejected, alus worth an ask. Since you is changing the content of your bio, slip in a message to say this. 

[Deleted Member]

8 hours ago, phoenyx said:

So, how do we put into words, the simple opening message expressed by eye-contact and body language?  As you pointed-out, it needs to be short and basic.

Well, I don't think there is one and there will be those in this thread that beg to differ but from what I can see, first contact is essentially imperfect.

 

 

[Si****]

I put a code word in my profile and blow me away, someone actually read my profile and used the code. In response, we have been chatting ever since and she is lovely.

I feel that I have been chatting to someone who is both real and interesting. It might only stay as being friends, but its been really uplifting and refreshing. Lets not spread the gloom and show others how to do a better job both in writing a profile and sending messages that are unique and interesting to read.

[Deleted Member]

Yesterday at 05:36 PM, ChiefNexus said:

#1 I've tried adding pics for my profile and they get rejected. Face pics included. #2 Relationship status is what it is. There are MANY others here because their significant other isn't into the same thing. #3 There's not a lot in my profile because I'm changing it. But thank you so much for your judgement.

I’m sorry you’ve seen it as judgment. I believe I was merely pointing out reasons why a woman might not reply.

[Deleted Member]

10 hours ago, Curvykate said:

I’m sorry you’ve seen it as judgment. I believe I was merely pointing out reasons why a woman might not reply.

What do you have to say to the other things he pointed out though? That people might assume he did these things for a completely different reason than why he actually did? This happens from a lack of communication, you see. If you don't ask, you don't find out - as they say.

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, BlushingFlush said:

What do you have to say to the other things he pointed out though? That people might assume he did these things for a completely different reason than why he actually did? This happens from a lack of communication, you see. If you don't ask, you don't find out - as they say.

He pointed out that his pics were getting rejected. I’m sorry to hear that and perhaps the tech team can help with that if Chief contacts them. I have found them to be good and reply quickly. Adding a note to that effect in the profile would explain that. Adding more to a profile takes little effort. If someone wants to be found attractive to others - they think about how to word their profile and make the changes. If someone chooses not to do that, well I’m afraid they will be judged on the words that are there. That’s life. Some people who aren’t single indicate that they are ethically non-monogamous or poly in their profile. I and many other women don’t wish to assist someone in cheating on their partner. That’s our right. If someone who isn’t single messages just to talk and learn and be friendly, I will reply though (and have to quite a few men on this site). I am allowed as anyone else is to have limits and criteria on who I want to communicate with. It’s my time and I happen to think my time is worth something.

[ey****]

4 hours ago, BlushingFlush said:

This happens from a lack of communication, you see. If you don't ask, you don't find out - as they say.

But then someone needs to have enough to be worth even asking.

[ey****]

I don't actually see "my pics get rejected" as any form of valid ground, tbh.

Harsh?  Maybe - but - in the time you are waiting for pictures to be approved you can get other look and feel of a site.  You can get an idea of who you might want to find more about, who seems interesting.  You can use this time to work on your profile.

If a pic then is rejected, you can work with support to find out why and use this again to further polish up.

Otherwise, you're not giving yourself a sporting chance contacting people with an incomplete profile - it suggests you are rushing.  That you're sloppy. That you're half-arsed.  That you want to put the minimum effort in and expect others to put in effort asking about you when you've made contact with them.

This is something people need to accept. No one owes you a response. No one owes you the time of day. If you're not interesting to them they won't reply. If you might be really interesting but nothing shows that you're interesting then you are making THEM do the work because YOU are interested - and that's emotional labour.

 

[Si****]

I know its a fine line between laying it all out there so people have nothing left to ask you about and not saying anything that others might find interesting. The one thing people know the most about is "themselves". (unless that even bores ones self, then you need to get out more)

When i comes to writing a message, if you cant be bothered to make it personal (no copy paste crap) then why should they believe you would put in the effort to any relationship? It not hard to read someone's profile and mention to them what it was that prompted you to make contact and message them. It shows you bothered to read their profile (they put the effort into it, so return the favour and read it) but it shows you chose them based on something they had to say about themselves and that your not so shallow and only go for looks.

If you don't get a reply, that's life. Your not what they are looking for and you have been saved from a poor match. Quit moaning and move on.

[Deleted Member]

@SirGreen

To be honest, I've seen this advice reoccurring - and mostly it's incorrect that you know, you read the profile, make sure your compatible etc. Then write a carefully constructed message that illustrates you read the profile and add reasons why you thought that person was interesting to you plus leave a question that would be fuel for additional conversation, etc. And I mean sure sometimes they view your profile and then don't correspond - fair enough but often not even that. @eyemblacksheep certainly seems to think this is about entitlement and says things like "well you're not owed" and etc.

But no, for me it's more curiosity - like why do all these people have stated such critical views about ice breakers - like the ones that right this in their profile - but then not bother to find out more when someone does put in more effort? How do they expect to find a meaningful connection when they don't try to imagine the other side of things - having to mostly put in the labour of going through all these profiles and messages that just get ignored, or offence deliberately sought out over small light-hearted jokes or fun randomness occasionally introduced to get a conversation going. To me, that's a lot more lazy than what people like eyem seem to think is laziness.

Oh I know, I know "but you're not owed a response or glance over your profile". It's a low energy dismissive response to say that kind of thing. I'm not trying to say anyone's obliged to respond. Just that if it is a more meaningful connection they're seeking and then you go complaining about things like "oh, well people who message me are all x" it shouldn't be a surprise when you don't get the desired interaction when you never invest in people that are y. I mean frankly, this comes to whether you should defend people when they are being deliberately obtuse because of gender politics and men harassing women online, when actually it's nothing to do with any of that it's just to do with people not seeing what they don't want to see.

Bottom line is, you are perfectly well entitled to see value wherever you're inclined to see value. Now don't let me tell you where to go looking. But if you only dig where there's rocks, don't expect to find diamonds.

[Si****]

1 hour ago, BlushingFlush said:

@SirGreen

To be honest, I've seen this advice reoccurring - and mostly it's incorrect that you know, you read the profile, make sure your compatible etc. Then write a carefully constructed message that illustrates you read the profile and add reasons why you thought that person was interesting to you plus leave a question that would be fuel for additional conversation, etc. And I mean sure sometimes they view your profile and then don't correspond - fair enough but often not even that. @eyemblacksheep certainly seems to think this is about entitlement and says things like "well you're not owed" and etc.

But no, for me it's more curiosity - like why do all these people have stated such critical views about ice breakers - like the ones that right this in their profile - but then not bother to find out more when someone does put in more effort? How do they expect to find a meaningful connection when they don't try to imagine the other side of things - having to mostly put in the labour of going through all these profiles and messages that just get ignored, or offence deliberately sought out over small light-hearted jokes or fun randomness occasionally introduced to get a conversation going. To me, that's a lot more lazy than what people like eyem seem to think is laziness.

Oh I know, I know "but you're not owed a response or glance over your profile". It's a low energy dismissive response to say that kind of thing. I'm not trying to say anyone's obliged to respond. Just that if it is a more meaningful connection they're seeking and then you go complaining about things like "oh, well people who message me are all x" it shouldn't be a surprise when you don't get the desired interaction when you never invest in people that are y. I mean frankly, this comes to whether you should defend people when they are being deliberately obtuse because of gender politics and men harassing women online, when actually it's nothing to do with any of that it's just to do with people not seeing what they don't want to see.

Bottom line is, you are perfectly well entitled to see value wherever you're inclined to see value. Now don't let me tell you where to go looking. But if you only dig where there's rocks, don't expect to find diamonds.

 That's the point, its more than what you say in your profile, more than what you say in your messages. Some women like tall men, some like short, some dark haired, some blond, some with beards, some clean shaven, some in suits, some in leather.... the list is endless.

Flashing the belly and masking your face might not hit the button, Slapping it out there as if to imply "here it is ladies, take it or not" might not be the thing they want. Just as i am bored of the standard overused cleavage shot on women. They have to have more to them than nice tits. I want to have a real conversation with a person with their own mind and a personality. It goes both ways.

As you say, its up to them if they seek a rock or a diamond. If they chose not to look at your profile, they have made their decision and you have to just live with it.

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, SirGreen said:

Flashing the belly and masking your face might not hit the button, Slapping it out there as if to imply "here it is ladies, take it or not" might not be the thing they want.

Or maybe a guy like that's simply appealing to more visually inclined women that maybe appreciate a softer, more subtle kind of erotica. Maybe he values his anonymity, or maybe the mask is part of something more elegant ... a secret society, perhaps? An underground fraternity,  where the symbolism of the mask and the revealed stomach actually convey a hidden message. It's one of those things - if you don't communicate, you don't find out about.

 

1 hour ago, SirGreen said:

Just as i am bored of the standard overused cleavage shot on women. They have to have more to them than nice tits.

Nothing wrong with cleavage. She may have other more artistic pictures on her profile. Or perhaps the cleavage is a part of some broader kind of scene - a corset, in a fancy hotel, perhaps. Night lights shining in, or perhaps a bright white sunrise that casts the right kind of shadow over her "assets". I mean that's the kind of thing you've just got to investigate to find out.

 

 

1 hour ago, SirGreen said:

As you say, its up to them if they seek a rock or a diamond. If they chose not to look at your profile, they have made their decision and you have to just live with it

I mean, they're 100% entitled to look at mud and perceive molten gold. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. All I'm saying is if that beholder get's frustrated no longer seeing the gold they had imagined, maybe here's a reason why. You can think of me as a deliverer of a message, don't hate me - hate the message. You know what they say about shooting the messenger - not cool, right?

[Jinxy]

If I’m understanding you correctly, @BlushingFlush, you’re essentially saying that people need to investigate past the initial message/profile regardless of how basic or intricate the greeting was? Is this correct? If this is what you’re getting at, as I said before, I don’t necessarily disagree with you. However, it’s also ignoring the other factors at play here which I think is essentially what some of the others are getting at. In general, people receiving the messages receive several in a day. It’s not in their best interest, nor do they necessarily have the time, to investigate into the deep meaning behind every single profile. Unfair? Perhaps. But it makes more sense for them to weigh the costs and benefits of replying to a person and their profile, taken at face value, and base it on their own past history, patterns they’ve seen with a certain type of message, eliminating criteria (profile pic, single status, etc), and others. 
 

You’re asking the people receiving these messages to treat every one as an opportunity to dig and learn about another person. While this in itself isn’t a faulty message, as I do believe everyone you ever meet has something to teach you, it’s only getting at one piece of the puzzle. While you yourself might treat the people you’re corresponding to with that same curiosity for who they are as a person, that’s generally the exception, not the rule for sites like these. So knowing that, people who receive messages are going to err on the side of caution. 

[Si****]

2 hours ago, BlushingFlush said:

Or maybe a guy like that's simply appealing to more visually inclined women that maybe appreciate a softer, more subtle kind of erotica. Maybe he values his anonymity, or maybe the mask is part of something more elegant ... a secret society, perhaps? An underground fraternity,  where the symbolism of the mask and the revealed stomach actually convey a hidden message. It's one of those things - if you don't communicate, you don't find out about.

 

Nothing wrong with cleavage. She may have other more artistic pictures on her profile. Or perhaps the cleavage is a part of some broader kind of scene - a corset, in a fancy hotel, perhaps. Night lights shining in, or perhaps a bright white sunrise that casts the right kind of shadow over her "assets". I mean that's the kind of thing you've just got to investigate to find out.

 

 

I mean, they're 100% entitled to look at mud and perceive molten gold. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. All I'm saying is if that beholder get's frustrated no longer seeing the gold they had imagined, maybe here's a reason why. You can think of me as a deliverer of a message, don't hate me - hate the message. You know what they say about shooting the messenger - not cool, right?

Or maybe you read too much into it and are just trying too hard to see more than what is there. Either way, good luck with it. time will tell.