Gender vs Biology

[Lu****]

6 hours ago, Gizeh89 said:

I don't quite get where you want to go with this.

If you find someone sexually attractive but you know that will change if they have certain body features you will have to ask at some point. Same with anything else if you want to date online. There are a bunch of things that you don't know about that person so you have to ask at some point.

What's interesting to you, at what point you ask those questions, etc is just up to you. Just exchange gender with something like tattoos and maybe your problems vanish?

Thanks ! 

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, TheMacabreBrat said:

If I was non-binary, I'd instantly block anyone asking if I had a penis. There is much more to me than what parts I have. 

It makes it seem like you only see others people has sexual objects. BDSM is so much more than just sex. Hell it doesn't even have to include sex.

 

As for how to do this more nicely, I have no idea because it's a pretty horrible thing to only care about if they have a penis or not.

Hi. 
Thanks for taking the time to reply and express your opinion.  

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, gemini_man said:

Whilst I understand it may present you with a dilemma of sorts - perhaps by taking a step back and treating people as people first and foremost, rather than as potential sexual partners is the way to go - get to know them as a person, understand their likes and dislikes etc and you'll probably find pointers that answer your questions come along the way.
.
Perhaps you could also make it clear on *your* profile that you are straight and have no interest in people with a penis though respect those that do - which then gives people you contact the information *they* need to know ahead of engaging or taking things down a route that may be a waste of their time.

Hi 

Thanks for your reply.  
I think your suggestion is a good one - though maybe a bit like this question in terms of how well it would be received - though I suspect a lot less contentiously! 
 

I may well give that a go ! 

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, TwoWolvez said:

Honestly just ask. If they choose to be offended by you asking a legit question then likely you're not going to be compatible anyway . Consider it a good filter question.

True but I was thinking of a polite way to ask so that I get to know with reduced potential for offending the other even if we are not compatible. 

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

Simple : they're not on "your radar"

 

I get where you are going that you would extend your search from cis women, to people who identify as non-binary but have a vagina.   

But, like, what does non binary mean to them?  Like, they may be vagina-owning and femme-presenting, and you might think "hey, no problem" - but do you understand their general needs here?   What if they, for example, wished to appear masc? or take T? Or have top surgery? Or, I dunno - not shave legs/body hair? 

If this is something where you can't go "I'd be ok with that!" then it's not a route to go down  

Thanks - that’s a good reply. 

[ey****]

just to tie a few comments together

So; first off - I think it is ultimately a good thing that someone is seeking to improve their understanding before diving in and making a meal of stuff

(though, objectifying people down to their genitals can be a little gross and probably explains some of the negative reaction.  And also as above, just because someone is not deliberately being malicious, doesn't mean their position isn't somewhat problematic)

Cos of that a little; if someone is listed as being non-binary it is, frankly, not your business what is in their pants.   If someone chooses to disclose, particularly if they themselves have a preference, that is one thing.  But if someone doesn't disclose and it is a problem to you depending on what their genitals are; you do not need to contact them.   

In kinda... real life situations (or online passive connections) it's somewhat different especially if you treat folk as people.  Because then you're not necessarily looking for someone who is NB, but hey you're building a friendship/connection/etc with someone who is NB and how they present, etc is in line with what would work for you.

[ma****]

1 hour ago, ThaliaV said:

Also... "every POV is valid" is a dangerous mindset to have. 

I agree that one can cause harm without intention to and I think it was important what you commented and appreciate it. I also believe it’s dangerous to say/stereotype one perspective is “not valid” for any reason just because you deem it wrong. I’m not talking fact vs opinion. I’m saying everyone has their own reality and experiences are going to create the lens they see the world. I struggled to learn this but universe taught me duality is a bitch and it’s beautiful, there’s rarely a right/wrong or valid/invalid dichotomy in nature.

[su****]

u can just say that u have a genital preference, which is a vagina and aren't aren't attracted to penises, put it in ur bio or tell a trans/nonbinary person that.they can then reply that it's fine or u won't work together. nothing wrong with having a preference or telling people u have a preference. just be aware of the language u are using

[Lu****]

6 hours ago, HappyFatLady said:

This is giving borderline offensive and I’m not understanding why it was allowed to be posted. But, I’ll give the admins the benefit of the doubt… My advice: Save non-binary the headache of having to deal with you and remove the search option “non-binary” from your FET account. If you’re that concerned, stick to cis women… but I doubt we want to be bothered with you either.

Hi. 
thanks for taking the time to express your opinion.  

[Lu****]

6 hours ago, PistolPhoenix said:

just dont get with trans & non binary people then if a penis is too scary for
you.

Non binary doesn’t necessarily means there is a penis.  But I take your point as intended. 
thanks for your reply 

[Lu****]

7 hours ago, PistolPhoenix said:

I genuinely dont feel like you would understand & nurture their experience and their desires if you are so focused on something they had no choice in. this does not read as “i want to support non binary people but idk how”, it reads as “i want to fuck nonbinary people but they find what i say offensive”. perhaps do
your own research. putting non binary in quotation marks and asking how to get with them without upsetting them abt the literal foundation to their experience as a person usually means: dont get with them then bc u dont understand & clearly dont know how to even approach sensitive subjects the people u wanna fuck. how am i supposed to help u be more sensitive when u put NonBinary in QUOTES!

Hi. 
sorry that you found so many negatives in my post but thanks for taking the time to reply.  I don’t necessarily agree with all of your points but I do respect your views. 

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, ThaliaV said:

I would agree with you in the borderline offensive but it also comes off that it's based in ignorance and transphobia.

Just like white people can be ignorantly racist and have problematic behaviors and ideas, people can also be ignorantly homophobic or transphobic. There's quite a lot of ignorance in the responses as well. 

OP, you should leave non-binary and trans people alone. Make sure you have on your profile here and any other dating site you might be in that you're only interested in cis women. However, be prepared for a lot of cis women to avoid you because of this. 

I'm not saying that you're being intentionally malicious but it's absolutely possible to be problematic and cause harm without the intent to do so.

Hi. 

Thanks for your reply.  

Taking the spirit of your post as it is meant - thanks for your contribution and I will heed your advice to leave them alone.  

[Lu****]

5 hours ago, Hezzair said:

I am kind of with ThaliaV and HappyFatLady on this one. While you are clearly not attempting to be at all offensive, it gives off microaggression. I am guessing this is because of implicit homophobic bias that you likely have that you don't even realize you have. My suggestion would honestly be that you just exclude the trans/NB folks from your search because you'd probably not do well with them in the long run. Ask yourself this and answer it honestly. Would you date a trans man, meaning some one who was assigned female at birth , but felt that body was not right and has chosen to ID as male in whatever way fits them best and does not have a penis? I am guessing the answer to that is probably no, especially if the trans man happens to be a burly looking dude with a beard.
Luke, we all have implicit biases, and the best we can do is try our best to get over them.

Hi. 
Thanks for your reply - though you don’t agree with my view it’s respectful and helpful.

For information I only mentioned non-binary in my post , not trans since trans is a known physical status so I don’t need to ask, whereas non-binary is not known in any way.  

I knew the post would get a range of answers from a range of viewpoints and I do appreciate all of the responses received.  

[Lu****]

4 hours ago, machete_mami said:

Literally nothing wrong with him only wanting to date cis women, or only wanting to date bodies with certain body parts. Does some internalized transphobia show a bit, sure. Does a *** of being perceived as offensive come thru, sure. I would give OP the benefit of the doubt clearly he’s going to great depths to try to not be harmful, so best thing is to politely point out the programming rather than shame him for having a preference and doing his best to communicate and ASK for help. Not everyone wants to work and play with all the human parts.

Hi. 
Thanks for giving me some credit. 
To be honest all replies come with their own viewpoints and truths so I do appreciate them all. 

[Lu****]

4 hours ago, machete_mami said:

I thought the quotes were simply an example of quoting from the profile… but now that you point that out along with your perspective, I see your point of view! It definitely reads as someone just wanting to fuck pussy, with zero regard to gender identity… but then again this is FET life so people are here to literally find fetish and fucks… so I just came here to say I think everyone’s POV is valid!

Hi. 
Thanks for you reply. 

I don’t want to spend time chatting, making an effort when if / should anything go forward it’s a no go.  So how to politely phrase an early question to save their time and hopes as well as my own is what I asked for.  

If I could get someone to fuck as easy and quickly as you imply I wouldn’t need to ask or consider time or feelings cos I would just move on to the next quick enough - which is far removed from the truth. 
 

But - that’s not to say I don’t take note of and appreciate your reply  Thanks ! 

 

[Lu****]

4 hours ago, GBirdie said:

Some of you people should be ashamed of yourself. Someone comes on here seeking advice so they can be less offensive to others and you rake him over the coals! Seriously. This is supposed to be a safe place to LEARN and explore. He is trying to learn how to address is preferences while simultaneously being respectful of someone else’s, how is that a bad thing? Yet some of you just berate him. Idgaf what pronouns you use, some of you need to check yourself and get off your damn high horse!

Hi. 
Everyone has a high horse, particularly when it’s an emotive matter. I knew the post would divide opinion and get mixed responses - but thanks for balancing it up a little.  

[Lu****]

4 hours ago, rosalicious said:

You could put on your profile that the most important quality you're looking for in a partner is that they have a vagina, I think that gets your desire across

In blunt old fashioned terms I’m a man looking for a woman.  
Stating “the most important quality .. is a vagina” is a back handed slap that I take note of.

[Ra****]

Don't talk about anybody else's body or parts. If you have a preference, talk about your preference. You don't need to know what they have between their legs. Speak your truth and let them speak theirs. You don't have the right to know anything.

[Ra****]

5 hours ago, GBirdie said:

Some of you people should be ashamed of yourself. Someone comes on here seeking advice so they can be less offensive to others and you rake him over the coals! Seriously. This is supposed to be a safe place to LEARN and explore. He is trying to learn how to address is preferences while simultaneously being respectful of someone else’s, how is that a bad thing? Yet some of you just berate him. Idgaf what pronouns you use, some of you need to check yourself and get off your damn high horse!

If they want to address their preferences, they can just express their preferences. What is offensive is the sense of entitlement to know what parts someone has. State your preference and let other people do what they will with it.

[De****]

I would make the statement that it is unlikely you would make a make a good match with a non binary person. A non binary person is unlikely to want someone whose first thought about them is the form of their genitalia. You are absolutely allowed your sexual preferences, but I think a person that defines their gender outside of binary and not in regard to their assigned gender at birth is not going to be a good match for someone who holds those things in high regard.

[De****]

12 hours ago, Craig1980 said:

I don't think you are being rude... you are a cis male looking for a cis female... that is all as you stated its about understanding and respect there are ppl in the world who are transgender and in that breath you want them to be understanding and respectful back...

A non binary person is no a cis female by definition. So simply put, they are not the person they are interested in. Simple.

[De****]

12 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

Simple : they're not on "your radar"

 

I get where you are going that you would extend your search from cis women, to people who identify as non-binary but have a vagina.   

But, like, what does non binary mean to them?  Like, they may be vagina-owning and femme-presenting, and you might think "hey, no problem" - but do you understand their general needs here?   What if they, for example, wished to appear masc? or take T? Or have top surgery? Or, I dunno - not shave legs/body hair? 

If this is something where you can't go "I'd be ok with that!" then it's not a route to go down  

Perfect. TLDR; these are not the droids you’re looking for.

[ba****]

I mean. If you prefer your partner not have a penis, you can write that in your bio. Then you don’t have to ask the question. But as someone who’s non-binary and has been asked that question, you kinda just have to put it out there. A simple “hey just to be transparent with you, I noticed you identify as non-binary and I wanted to let you know I’m only interested in people with vaginas” or anything along those lines is fine. Fact of the matter is there’s always gonna be someone upset no matter how you do it so as long as you approach it with respect and kindness you’re fine. That being said, don’t open the whole conversation just out of pocket asking about the other person’s genitals that’s just bad manners.

[ba****]

9 hours ago, ace2587 said:

My personal opinion is that folks prefer to be intentionally misleading rather than up front about everything in the profile, and that is pretty much at the root of the problem. I’m very sure people are ready to disagree with me, and that is fine. Just my personal opinion, that’s all.

In all fairness, the default for a non-binary profile asks penis measurements so unless that person openly puts out what genitals they have, you can’t ever be 100% sure

[Pi****]

you dont agree w my points and found negativity? what? im giving u honest feedback as someone who is nonbinary. tf? lmfaooooooo i was nice to you even 💀