Feeding into narcissism

[PhantomFlogger]

I'm a narcissist, that is to say i have a Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) it governs everything i do and all that i think.

I'm confident, straight forward, driven and self assured. Im also broken, easy to hurt and require adoration to function.

I love BDSM, the rules and deep trusts really hit that spot in me that says "mmm...YES!" but should someone with NPD have all that power, is it a slippery slope where confidence and inflated self worth are ultimately the reason we feel we can do no wrong and yet hurt so many in our wake.

Don't get me wrong, and without going too much into it, NPD does not equal bad, in fact id like to think that the constant need to be perfect and admired is my biggest motivation to, well, be perfect and admirable. My crippling *** of making mistakes means i never do anything half-assed, i study and learn everything i apply myself to.

What I want to know is, does complete power corrupt completely? Does having a sub *** a narcissist to become unwell?

Even the best intended narcissist will lose there way if their delusions of grandeur are rein***d by a submissive holding them far too high.

There are many types of NPD, many share attributes, many contradict eachother, there are people who are treated and others who go their whole life never knowing. 

Is BDSM a feeding ground for narcissists to pick off inexperienced subs and get that fix of power and control, or is it the best place for us? Rules, protocol, community and dynamics in a safe, "sane" and consentual manner... clinical and a way to vent.

I honestly dont know, but what i do know is it scares me how well BDSM feeds into all personality disorders and speaking from experience being a narcissist makes me attractive in this community, if only at first. I see myself sometimes, rope in one hand and a flogger in the other and wonder if i should have all this power.

 

[Ba****]

I think that having a brat might help with the "corrupt completely" bit. It, for lack of a better word, ***s the D-Type to have a playful banter that might ground them.

If someone with NPD knows what puts them into that unwell state of mind, I feel like they should be able to stay away from it or only engage in it as a treat.

I don't know what it's like to have NPD. But knowing what my own mental disorders makes me feel, if I'm feeling depressed, I won't engage in knife play. It'll be self-harm.

I hope someone can give a better answer. I tried, but it might be way off course. Lol

[Li****]

It's admirable that you were so honest and open.
There is definitely a time, place, and (hugely) mindset for NPD, or any mental disorder, especially when it comes to any form of intimacy but especially rougher, primal, BDSM and the likes.
It sounds like for you, it's a matter of trusting yourself to know yourself and when it's appropriate for you to hold "all this power."
We all have the responsibility of knowing when it's right or good for us and the other/s involved and when it isn't.
You sound like you're being as mature, responsible, and level-headed as you can be to take the necessary steps to have safe fun.
I don't think my comment has answered what you wanted. But honestly, it sounds like that's something only you'll know of yourself.
Best of luck with it all 🌄

[AKA_Copper]

My two pence worth,

I think that there is a difference between someone with NPD who isn't accepting of the diagnosis and someone who is accepting of it and has a good awareness as to how it affects them

[MxyBunny]

This is something I've been thinking about for a while. I've noticed that NPD has, whether rightly or wrongly, become incredibly vilified in recent years. Narcissist has become a synonym for bad person, even though we all understand it's essentially a mental health disorder. It seems to have some unique features that make people mentally respond differently to it, such as its near total imperviousness to therapy, the almost guaranteed toxicity of the individual, and the cunning and self awareness that underpins those toxic behaviours associated with it. The result is people seem to feel comfortable citing it as a reason to write someone off rather than just a diagnosis. Where one might say of a bipolar person "they are having a BPD episode" or "they need to adjust their meds" When it comes to NPD it's very much like people think they slapped a mental health label on pure evil, and it is weaponised accordingly. Now, I try to be compassionate to everyone, and I understand with some personality types that's not reciprocal. I don't think it needs to be for them to be deserving of that compassion. By and large we do not choose our mental or neurological states, I say this as a human train wreck of ADHD, Autism, Dyspraxia and depression. So it makes me uncomfortable to see this behaviour of treating a specific mental condition as just "bad person" normalised. Your post does seem to indicate one can live within this condition and try to be a good person who is cognizant of boundaries, respect and decency. It seems that people like yourself can at least make a concerted effort to get through life without hurting anyone. Just like how there can be "good psychopaths", whether they got there through cold, vulcan-like reasoning or some residue of sincere compassion, it's the effort that matters. I don't agree with treating a condition as the sum of a person's worth, or the first and final line of their personal profile. I think as long as you're even asking questions like these and working to avoid causing harm as you move through life, you're doing things right. It's a good thing to be aware of dangerous flaws, but don't use it to punish yourself or live in this nightmare of constant anxiety. Communicate with those around you regularly, and as long as they are comfortable, I think it's okay to let yourself be comfortable too. This world needs all sorts. We even need the psychopaths in times of war, don't we? So I see no reason why your strengths can't be utilised in a safe and respectful way too.

[Im****]

As a dominant, this is a purely hypothetical response. In my opinion, if I was a submissive, I would rather put my trust in someone with NPD that is not only open and honest about it, but has the concerns you do, than a dominant without NPD that seems to confuse the terms "dominant" with "asshole". What you have done shows trust and honesty and I for one applaud that 🤝

[Deleted Member]

Thank you for being *** and sharing this. Your self awareness and openness is admirable here. I tend to agree with @Mxy that narcissist doesn’t always mean a bad person.
.
You already articulated why a narcissist may not make a good Dom and it’s very simple. Being a Dom is not about you It is about the sub, the experience you give them, and monitoring their reactions to it. You have to be able to comprehend and appreciate what they are going though, and value the gift they are giving you.
.
My advice is for you to switch and sub for a particularly cruel and brutal Dom. Then you might appreciate the power and control you are being gifted, and substantially less likely to *** it -if that’s what you worry about.

[do****]

I think the best you can do for yourself is ask a therapist about it and I mean this in the best way possible :)

Because as you say, it could be either one or the other, it could be very the***utic to live out psychological patterns in a safe and controlled environment or it could be just feeding into behavioural patterns that you are usually trying to break out of in your daily life.

In my view that's the only way you would have a qualified answer that can also guide you to what's best for your personal mental health and wellbeing. Even from a selfish perspective this makes the most sense, why would you want to put yourself in a situation that might be damaging to you?

Also not wanting to judge the question here, I understand that licensed therapists are often not easily available and it's a good idea to ask in the community too. But my immediate thought was that this would probably be the best if it's possible to you :)

[Sh****]

True NPD does not know nor would ever admit to having it and it cannot be treated. They’d most likely convince others of having it through gaslighting. I spent 17 years with one and almost ruined my life. If I sensed someone had true NPD I would run for the hills. Typically people with NPD lack self awareness and I would never trust someone like that to ever get near me sexually or emotionally. That being said, we all have narcissistic traits, but that’s a huge difference from actually having the personality disorder.

[PhantomFlogger]

Guess im not a true Narcissist, I cant wait to tell my therapist 😂

I see where you are coming from, and you are right, I had no clue until i was diagnosed with it. 

 

[MxyBunny]

On 7/1/2023 at 11:23 AM, PhantomFlogger said:

Guess im not a true Narcissist, I cant wait to tell my therapist 😂

I see where you are coming from, and you are right, I had no clue until i was diagnosed with it. 

 

I chose not to respond to her at the time, although I wanted to, because I don't want to start a fight, and it sounds like she is talking from a place of personal trauma so there's nothing to be gained from arguing with that, but her response is very much the kind of thing I was thinking about in my post. It's become a trope in modern culture that NPD just means bad person, and that really disturbs me. I think because in some ways I know what that's like.

I've had people define me as "lazy" or "selfish" person all my life, where in truth the traits they were identifying were not under my control. Lack of motivation, lack of discipline, inability to focus on managing tasks, extreme executive disfunction. Calling me lazy is like accusing a wheelchair-bound person of not trying hard enough to walk, and people in modern society are starting to become cognizant of that. But NPD is this weird exception where we have defined what is obviously some form of mental illness, and yet still speak about it like it's demonic possession.

I don't know how capable of empathizing with others you are, I don't know all the details of your condition, but I think that denying you kindness, compassion, and the opportunity to become more than the sum of your disability would be a greater reflection on me as a person than it could ever be on you. You SEEM to be concerned about the dangers of your condition interacting with others through this lifestyle, so I think you're trying to be a good person - and that counts for something. Why should we write you off just because of the reputation of your condition? You didn't choose it!

Hell, maybe I'm just being manipulated by you right now, but we just can't let ourselves think like that, we'd go mad. It's the same way conspiracy nutjobs are born. You can't get knotted in these spiralling hypothetical webs of paranoia and subtext, in the end you just have to take people at face value, with some caution reserved, until you have reason to think otherwise. I think you should be proud of yourself for wanting to be aware of how your condition could affect others, and wanting to work on yourself. I understand that NPD has a reputation for being un-therapy-able (lol), but I'm not willing to deny someone the respect earned from apparent personal growth based on propaganda.

I hope you are doing well, and I hope you can continue to live with your condition in as healthy a way as it permits, and I am sorry people are so willing to disregard you because of something beyond your control. In the end all that matters is whether you and those you interact with are doing okay. If there's something sinister going on internally, I don't care. I'm not interested in policing thought crime and I encourage everyone else to hold the same position. It's frankly an immature attitude that stems from the valid but irrational raw emotion of previous scars. A worldview built on scars is too cynical to function.

You deserve to exist. Take care and be safe. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by MxyBunny

[PhantomFlogger]

3 hours ago, MxyBunny said:

I chose not to respond to her at the time, although I wanted to, because I don't want to start a fight, and it sounds like she is talking from a place of personal trauma so there's nothing to be gained from arguing with that, but her response is very much the kind of thing I was thinking about in my post. It's become a trope in modern culture that NPD just means bad person, and that really disturbs me. I think because in some ways I know what that's like.

I've had people define me as "lazy" or "selfish" person all my life, where in truth the traits they were identifying were not under my control. Lack of motivation, lack of discipline, inability to focus on managing tasks, extreme executive disfunction. Calling me lazy is like accusing a wheelchair-bound person of not trying hard enough to walk, and people in modern society are starting to become cognizant of that. But NPD is this weird exception where we have defined what is obviously some form of mental illness, and yet still speak about it like it's demonic possession.

I don't know how capable of empathizing with others you are, I don't know all the details of your condition, but I think that denying you kindness, compassion, and the opportunity to become more than the sum of your disability would be a greater reflection on me as a person than it could ever be on you. You SEEM to be concerned about the dangers of your condition interacting with others through this lifestyle, so I think you're trying to be a good person - and that counts for something. Why should we write you off just because of the reputation of your condition? You didn't choose it!

Hell, maybe I'm just being manipulated by you right now, but we just can't let ourselves think like that, we'd go mad. It's the same way conspiracy nutjobs are born. You can't get knotted in these spiralling hypothetical webs of paranoia and subtext, in the end you just have to take people at face value, with some caution reserved, until you have reason to think otherwise. I think you should be proud of yourself for wanting to be aware of how your condition could affect others, and wanting to work on yourself. I understand that NPD has a reputation for being un-therapy-able (lol), but I'm not willing to deny someone the respect earned from apparent personal growth based on propaganda.

I hope you are doing well, and I hope you can continue to live with your condition in as healthy a way as it permits, and I am sorry people are so willing to disregard you because of something beyond your control. In the end all that matters is whether you and those you interact with are doing okay. If there's something sinister going on internally, I don't care. I'm not interested in policing thought crime and I encourage everyone else to hold the same position. It's frankly an immature attitude that stems from the valid but irrational raw emotion of previous scars. A worldview built on scars is too cynical to function.

You deserve to exist. Take care and be safe. 

Thank you, I know what i am, and i agree with the haters. there are 5 types or NPD and only 1 is spoken about so i dont blame people for not knowing.

Inside I am all the bad things..

Manipulative, ***, prone to rage, grandiose, malignant amongst other things but my flavour of NPD causes me to always feel hated because nobody loves me as much as i love myself.. we devote ourselves to never being "only human" until one day we have spent so long doing good things that people see us as good people, except we know we are horrible toxic people and perfection isnt enough.

I live in a constant state of disgust.. everything that isnt "Right" makes me fight, flight, freeze or fawn. And friends and family are extensions of me, i love them with such a ferocity but i hold them to the standard i hold myself, and that is problematic at best.

I think if there are any people out there reading this who have covert, *** or introverted npd, just be aware of your limits, tell your partner how to stop a disgust attack, make it clear that you might act a certain way if something happens and it can be stopped in its tracks. You will love bomb on monday and forget them on Tuesday, its part of it, but find a way to comfort them even if the idea of touching them makes you physically nauseous. The key is to not ignore it and let it build up, find a way to let them know how you feel without getting repulsed by them.. i personally struggle with my gf kissing me too long, or if my mouth gets wet and she spreads it across my face like a slime produ..... i digress, i just make a mmmmmwah noise, kiss her really hard and pull away. This means "GET THE FUCK OFF MY FACE" or sometimes i just make a fake sick noise and laugh if she does something my NPD doesn't like. A few minutes later ill be fine, but the rage is real.

[Leisa]

I believe, and I could absolutely be dead wrong, that since you know you have this condition and are aware of the triggers that bring out the negative behaviors, that you are in a much better place than a crapload of others. What you will absolutely require is a submissive who is aware of your condition and is strong enough to tell you when your need for control bleeds out too far. Or simply one who is strong enough to tell you that unless you can rein in those behaviors, the trust within the dynamic will be broken and it’s time to part ways.

I thought I saw a comment up the thread that said NPD cannot be treated. I want to see their degree because according to my psychiatrist, there isn’t a mental health condition that cannot be treated and controlled utilizing the proper methods whether through medication, talk therapy, TMC, etc. Like anything else in life, the key to success is knowing what the issue is, accepting that it exists, making the determination to submit to treatment, and embracing the knowledge that it doesn’t need to destroy you or those around you.

Of course, you could always find a brat who will spin you up like a top until you cannot remember who is supposed to have the control. I mean, do us brats ever really, 100% give complete control to someone else without our imagination dreaming up ways to slip through a loophole?

[PhantomFlogger]

On 7/4/2023 at 5:42 AM, Leisa said:

I believe, and I could absolutely be dead wrong, that since you know you have this condition and are aware of the triggers that bring out the negative behaviors, that you are in a much better place than a crapload of others. What you will absolutely require is a submissive who is aware of your condition and is strong enough to tell you when your need for control bleeds out too far. Or simply one who is strong enough to tell you that unless you can rein in those behaviors, the trust within the dynamic will be broken and it’s time to part ways.

I thought I saw a comment up the thread that said NPD cannot be treated. I want to see their degree because according to my psychiatrist, there isn’t a mental health condition that cannot be treated and controlled utilizing the proper methods whether through medication, talk therapy, TMC, etc. Like anything else in life, the key to success is knowing what the issue is, accepting that it exists, making the determination to submit to treatment, and embracing the knowledge that it doesn’t need to destroy you or those around you.

Of course, you could always find a brat who will spin you up like a top until you cannot remember who is supposed to have the control. I mean, do us brats ever really, 100% give complete control to someone else without our imagination dreaming up ways to slip through a loophole?

Haha, we will see. Ive been practicing BDSM seriously for about 10 and a bit years now (prior to that i was primal but didnt do the research or events) 

Ever since i was investigated by my place of work on accusations of being into BDSM and had to defend myself in 2 separate hearings "proving" im not, i have distanced myself from kink. And even at my ***k play ive never been a fan of disobedience or bratting in play. Cnc and struggles are good, but being annoying for fun doesn't improve the experience for me, lots do enjoy it though.

And, as far as NPD not being treatable, it truly is treatable but it takes dedication and the willingness to allow yourself to be hurt and not respond. But i know that it isnt curable. We just get better at not hurting others, the inner workings cant change, its a personally issue. A personality Disorder is a set of triggers and responses built by your brain to minimise ***. Ive learnt that being more understanding of others and less defensive means i upset people less, and when i upset people less they upset me less. This means my triggers are less frequent and not overlapping all day. Though there is a huge disadvantage, one i struggle with constantly, I have to maintain a low self esteem which means hurting my own feeling to save others feelings. Any feeling of self worth has to be pushed deep down or i become an arsehole. So, no, it never goes away, no therapy will ever help my triggers, but it can help my reactions.

In short, therapy helps others like me, it doesn't help me like them.