Changes in the community

[Deleted Member]

The community. With over 30 years of experience, I am amazed at the developments in the community and the direction that has been taken. I regularly speak to women, and blogs pass by in which women indicate how they are treated here, and about disrespectful messages they receive. How different this was decades ago. Women were treated with the utmost respect. Nowadays you have the internet and apps, the information is a mouse click away, and a mentor you can consult is easy to find on apps. Yet it appears that many Dominants do not master the art, the customs and protocols, and disrespectfully go "to war" to hope to fish a submissive out of the pond in all their desperation. The advice to all these Dominants is: immerse yourself in the matter of BDSM, immerse yourself in the art that it is, immerse yourself in the protocols that apply. Submissives looking for a Dominant do not want vulgar and disrespectful messages. And certainly don't expect them to submit to such lack of knowledge and respect

[Deleted Member]

I think whether old school traditionalist or new wave, as it were, there is only one protocol that really matters and that's basic human decency, especially when meeting someone new. The problem as I see it is pre internet the only way to meet others was face to face, so good behaviour was a must. You hit the nail on the head, as with the net, it's easy to hide behind a screen and behave however you wish. Also many want everything today, and as such patience is also a dying art, so many push way to hard thinking submissive means stupid, and easy. Porn also I believe plays a part in such behaviour and it's not really that surprising as it's so readily available, and some can be quite extreme so it's easy to think this is how "sex" is done, this is how women like to be touched, used, approached etc. Society as a whole has changed dramatically so much over the last 30 odd years, with in general less manners and respect, it's not surprising at all that these attitudes of me, me, me and I want, today, are now infecting the online world so much, especially the dating apps such as this. Many don't care about protocol, manners, respect as all they can  think about is getting their rocks off.

[Deleted Member]

54 minutes ago, DonnyPrimal said:

I think whether old school traditionalist or new wave, as it were, there is only one protocol that really matters and that's basic human decency, especially when meeting someone new. The problem as I see it is pre internet the only way to meet others was face to face, so good behaviour was a must. You hit the nail on the head, as with the net, it's easy to hide behind a screen and behave however you wish. Also many want everything today, and as such patience is also a dying art, so many push way to hard thinking submissive means stupid, and easy. Porn also I believe plays a part in such behaviour and it's not really that surprising as it's so readily available, and some can be quite extreme so it's easy to think this is how "sex" is done, this is how women like to be touched, used, approached etc. Society as a whole has changed dramatically so much over the last 30 odd years, with in general less manners and respect, it's not surprising at all that these attitudes of me, me, me and I want, today, are now infecting the online world so much, especially the dating apps such as this. Many don't care about protocol, manners, respect as all they can  think about is getting their rocks off.

You have a point with decency. You get this from home, and it is also part of the written and unwritten rules within BDSM. I think every Dom would agree with me that no sub will voluntarily submit to a Dom with indecent behavior. I do not see the link with porn as the cause, even 30 years ago you had porn, although you had to go to the video store and it was not available on mouse click like now. Are you a Dom / Master / Owner if your opening sentence is eg "Hey cunt, I'm gonna fuck your brains out"? I think these guys are rather looking for a free quick seesaw, and even bad at that.

[Deleted Member]

@PaddyMasterand @DonnyPrimal I totally agree with all of your comments. Having spoken to some on here it too amazes me how the females on this site are spoken to, presumed to behave and how respect, manners and politeness seems to go out the window.
It disgusts me some of the things I’ve been informed of how certain individuals behave towards others and also how some border on the realms of bullying just to ‘try’ to prove something, I mean what are they trying to prove, that they do not see the opposite sex as human beings???
Porn does bare a factor in this as like @DonnyPrimal states it is perceived that, that is the ‘normal’ way to act and behave nowadays which is a shame. From personal experience communicating with someone and also engaging with someone in a respectful manner will get you a lot further than not and I also get the fact that for some it is the way they want to be treated but there is always a time and a place for the domination to enter into the factor of things.
It also has become apparent that through conversations a large majority receive an opening message with a certain picture being an introduction or a certain demoralising comment that the sender hopes will get a reaction to, thank goodness for the ‘block’ button I say, a true dominant in my opinion would not act in this way but perhaps these so called ‘Doms’ are claiming to be something they are really not!

[Deleted Member]

7 minutes ago, PaddyMaster said:

You have a point with decency. You get this from home, and it is also part of the written and unwritten rules within BDSM. I think every Dom would agree with me that no sub will voluntarily submit to a Dom with indecent behavior. I do not see the link with porn as the cause, even 30 years ago you had porn, although you had to go to the video store and it was not available on mouse click like now. Are you a Dom / Master / Owner if your opening sentence is eg "Hey cunt, I'm gonna fuck your brains out"? I think these guys are rather looking for a free quick seesaw, and even bad at 

What I meant about porn is pretty much what you say, it was not as easy to get hold of as it is now. A few clicks and away we go, even for very young folk, it's no real surprise it warps their view of "sex." When I first discovered porn it was of course hard-core, but  compared to the stuff today it was I see now actually really tame.

[qu****]

The other thing is how do these "Doms" behave in a vanilla sense as in if on a "normal" site or even in real life do they expect women to just drop their knickers just because they're on a dating site,I'd imagine so, respect and manners cost nothing and are fundamental in earning trust going forward, now this may sound odd but I wonder if the effect of mothers no longer allowed to take the kids fruit picking and such may have a bearing, I'm of the generation where as a kid if you went to work with your mother in effect all the other mums were seen the same way, as in if any of them caught you up to mischief you knew you were in trouble, even more so when your mum found out, what I'm trying to say is respect is learnt from a young age, and without wide social interactions can cause problems in later life, not for all granted but for some, I hope this makes sense

[Deleted Member]

Manners and respect need to be learned from an early age and that used to be the normal when I was growing up. There seemed to be a concrete boundary between acceptable behaviour and insulting behaviour. At school the Teachers and staff were firmly in control and so were older members of my family. I worked in a family retail business and remember my Grandad addressing women as Madame and I was regularly available to carry bags of fruit and vegetables to their car or taxi from our market stall. Apart from landline phones every conversation was in real time. Fast forward to today with it’s primarily text talk communication with all its problems that have been mentioned as well as being misunderstood by a typo error or internet connection, oh lord take me back to 1982 !!!

[Deleted Member]

9 minutes ago, quietlysure said:

The other thing is how do these "Doms" behave in a vanilla sense as in if on a "normal" site or even in real life do they expect women to just drop their knickers just because they're on a dating site,I'd imagine so, respect and manners cost nothing and are fundamental in earning trust going forward, now this may sound odd but I wonder if the effect of mothers no longer allowed to take the kids fruit picking and such may have a bearing, I'm of the generation where as a kid if you went to work with your mother in effect all the other mums were seen the same way, as in if any of them caught you up to mischief you knew you were in trouble, even more so when your mum found out, what I'm trying to say is respect is learnt from a young age, and without wide social interactions can cause problems in later life, not for all granted but for some, I hope this makes sense

Porn can certainly have an effect. Porn has gotten a lot harder over the years, I agree. I think there are plenty who want rough hard sex, and are looking for a partner on apps like this. With that, they still don't have the right to harass women, and to pollute apps like this with their lack of decency

[Deleted Member]

4 minutes ago, PaddyMaster said:

Porn can certainly have an effect. Porn has gotten a lot harder over the years, I agree. I think there are plenty who want rough hard sex, and are looking for a partner on apps like this. With that, they still don't have the right to harass women, and to pollute apps like this with their lack of decency

Sorry TAROTT, I replied wrong by mistake and can't delete this one

[Deleted Member]

Lol Paddy just mentioned typo errors. No problem mate 

[Slavemarty]

I agree you still need manners and respect that normal but certain people just are forward and rude no need to be I think

[Ni****]

It's really not difficult to get .... You wouldn't walk up to a woman you don't know and say graphically what you'd like to do to her sexually, so why is online any different?

[Deleted Member]

I’ve found men on so-called vanilla dating sites say similar things to me as on the kinky ones like Fetish. Still rude and misogynistic. It’s just here they tend to be messages about taking me for a walk with my collar and lead on or being their sub instantly. But I don’t want you fellows to think that I judge all men because of that poor behaviour. It actually means we appreciate the good ones more and know how to spot them.

[Mo****]

15 minutes ago, Curvykate said:

I’ve found men on so-called vanilla dating sites say similar things to me as on the kinky ones like Fetish. Still rude and misogynistic. It’s just here they tend to be messages about taking me for a walk with my collar and lead on or being their sub instantly. But I don’t want you fellows to think that I judge all men because of that poor behaviour. It actually means we appreciate the good ones more and know how to spot them.

Definitely! The horrible, pushy, misogynistic ones make it so much better for normal, decent ones that can hold a conversation! An interesting, articulate conversation is more likely to get me interested in a person and increase my engagement and attention, than some of the stuff I get.

[Deleted Member]

Ref CurvyKate / Morganna . I’m so pleased to hear the female view and opinion on this matter. As you are both aware that men have two brains and are dominated and controlled by the dumber one. Now depending on how many times dumb brain gets told off, rejected and reprimanded, dumb brain may ask his “thinking brain “ for advice. If “ thinking brain has been brought up in an environment where bad behaviour is daily life then it’s going to be bad going to worse for help. I recently saw a poster that read “ men are dogs and need controlling “ . Times are changing but in my opinion too slowly and it’s now time to start the education of boys to see women in a more positive way . Relationship education should be a serious school subject 

[Roxy1957]

Women should be worshipped. Even the ones that are subs.

[Theonebrat]

I would like advice on this if anyone is willing to give it. In my recent experience I have met many different people who claim to be masters. Then when I ask them to explain their kinks or ideas about what that means they say that bdsm is just a game that should not be taken seriously and I find a problem with this. I feel like I’m right about it and I expressed that I am not comfortable with their ideas and don’t want to pursue any kind of sexual relationship with them due to the fact I do not think it is safe. They are trying to make me believe I am wrong about it, and that I am being close minded. What should I do ? 

[Theonebrat]

One person also told me that if they feel bored or no longer interested in doing something with their submissive then it no longer is fun to them and “ just becomes work “ 

[Ni****]

21 minutes ago, Theonebrat said:

I would like advice on this if anyone is willing to give it. In my recent experience I have met many different people who claim to be masters. Then when I ask them to explain their kinks or ideas about what that means they say that bdsm is just a game that should not be taken seriously and I find a problem with this. I feel like I’m right about it and I expressed that I am not comfortable with their ideas and don’t want to pursue any kind of sexual relationship with them due to the fact I do not think it is safe. They are trying to make me believe I am wrong about it, and that I am being close minded. What should I do ? 

BDSM isn't a game, and if a Master can't even explain what their kinks are, then they're a Master by name only. A Ds relationship takes communication, effort, trust and time, and they shouldn't be trying to convince you otherwise.

[Deleted Member]

Every woman I talk to has had bad experiences with men on sites like this.

We get our own problems too, number of times someone’s been a faux sub trying to sell me their link is getting ridiculous.

I’d much rather have my problem than theirs though!

[SammyB]

I come from the same era give or take a few years lol

I couldn’t agree more with what you have said

The changes are so dramatic
I find myself lost in many ways

I find myself horrified at some of the behaviour by both D types and s

It’s a world of instaDom fakeDoms and silly girls who “play “ at being sub

However to bring balance
There are many advantages to a slightly more relaxed approach and I have learned I enjoy that approach compared to what I had 24 yrs when there was protocols and etiquette for everything imaginable

I think the community has grown in many ways and kink is also openly accepted nowadays . 24 yrs ago you only got into the community if you knew someone
It was underground and little information was freely available

I also think it’s diluted the community in many ways as we have lost many things like rituals , protocols , etiquette, manners , little is spoken bout things like or the four pillars

I’ve described this often as old school new school however I would go as far as with some of the new social norms i can only describe it in a derogatory manner I call it Bs Ds ..

I believe there is no right way or wrong way every dynamic / relationship is different personally I don’t believe jumping in is the right thing

I believe everyone should educate themselves bout certain social norms within the community particularly the basics

There are almost another set of norms now that happens because it’s “online “

These norms are frowned upon openly and raised on the forum but yet it continues ... the attitude of it’s just how it is now appears to be creeping in

As with every community each generation makes their own mark and stamp and things change

Things will change constantly but let’s try to ensure the basics like respect and being non judgmental are priority for all

Just because we don’t agree on something or like something doesn’t mean it’s not right or wrong

[Deleted Member]

On 3/22/2021 at 9:59 AM, PaddyMaster said:

Yet it appears that many Dominants do not master the art, the customs and protocols, and disrespectfully go "to war" to hope to fish a submissive out of the pond in all their desperation. The advice to all these Dominants is: immerse yourself in the matter of BDSM, immerse yourself in the art that it is, immerse yourself in the protocols that apply. Submissives looking for a Dominant do not want vulgar and disrespectful messages. And certainly don't expect them to submit to such lack of knowledge and respect

The poor behaviour said to exist within the community today is not limited to men, and it is not limited to Dominants either. To be honest this questionable behaviour along with the lack of learning and education about BDSM applies to Dominants and submissives & slaves alike across the gender spectrum. It is not solely the responsibility of the Dominant to be the one educated in all things BDSM, to understand the basic rules of what D/s or M/s is, to apply the protocols or to know the practical skills required to flog, cane, whip etc. Education is the responsibility of all in the community no matter what side of the slash they reside on, no matter what gender, sexual orientation or type/level of play they engage in. It is up to each individual to have manners, be polite, treat others with respect and to be educated in what the world of BDSM is. I as a Domme/Mistress do not want or engage with a sub or slave who is vulgar, disrespectful, lacks the awareness and understanding important for BDSM, just as that sub or slave has the choice to not interact with or accept the same behaviour from a Domme/Mistress who displays such traits. It is our own personal responsibility to know how to behave and act accordingly within the confines of each particuar interaction had within the broad spectrum that is BDSM. For at the end of the day mutual respect, along with effective communication, trust, and honesty are the foundation stones from which fulfilling, lasting, creative and worthwhile dynamics and interations originiate and it is up to each of us to maintain the foundations required to keep this BDSM community thriving.

[ey****]

there's often a lot of mixed views I have.  

I'm not (quite) old enough to remember pre-internet.  But, there are differences I can see in the sense that I was first active when I was 18/19 and then went away for a bit, and came back after well over a decade away.

So. For example. I went to a fetish club which, basically, bounced from venue to venue.  Their ability to advertise was limited and between venues not always being happy with activities that were happening, they often also had the problem with the venues not always being happy with turnout.   There's a story often gets told of a venue that said they could have use of the venue providing they could be sure the bar would take £1000 - near the end of the night the bar was sat circa £800 so the promoter ended up slapping down £200 on the bar and buying a nightcap for everyone, but of course that coin was from the take from the event to cover the actual costs of running.

Now, of course, it's much easier to advertise events.

There wasn't as much information freely available then - and some of the websites that did exist were very ideology driven and I remember being called stupid when I repeated something from one such site and that "I shouldn't believe the internet" (obviously, we all trust the internet enough to be here - but - there are, particularly older, folk I know who do not bother with any fetish websites) on one hand this did mean a lot of learning was driven through in person conversation - but on another, this meant you were very much limited by time and availability.  It was also very difficult to do learning or research in your own time and you might really only get one persons perspective or ideology  

Again. Now there's a wealth of information online and it's much easier to get different perspectives.  

A key thing though.

Obviously the increased accessibility can bring it's own problems and sometimes instead of gatekeeping who can come in for the best of time - we instead need to focus on dealing with those who are out of line when they do come in.  There can also be a lot more rabbling at the door, which can again be those who send the totally inappropriate messages.

But, when folk talk about days gone by and how everyone was always respectful, I do raise a slight eyebrow.  Pre and early internet; where did folk go if they'd had a problem at a fetish event and weren't satisfied with the response from the organiser? In ways, they couldn't even go to the police because depending on what it was might be something the police wouldn't understand and/or it would incriminate the event/community.   If, say, a sub wasn't happy with something and their Dominant did the "real subs don't say no" shit, did they have the means to learn this wasn't right? Now, of course - someone who feels something isn't right and don't know who to turn to can write a blog or forum post - which can bring in views from all parts of the wider community without bias to protect someone who throws a good event.

Just reading a piece today about the Cloak & Dagger club in LA which was run by, well, older people prescribing to the ways of traditional BDSM and using this to prey on young women.  So, they never really respected women.

There's also been plenty of people in recent years who are, or were, in positions of status due to longevity who it turned out were hiding *** behind BDSM (and some quite serious *** cases - including minors) 

Ultimately; I think one of the big differences over the years is information and accessibility - and this comes with it's good and bad.  But, the bad has always kinda been there even if it wasn't always seen.

[Deleted Member]

I can only comment (read 'rant') from my own perspective so forgive me if it offends... this is a can-o-worms type topic! Haha

I've spent many hours putting the World to rights over this very issue with others here. No other topic boils my piss quicker!

I couldn't agree more with your post @PaddyMaster and thank you for sharing It.

I think it has a lot to do with how men treat other men these days, perhaps more so than how they treat other women. Certainly in the UK in my own limmited experiance.

Mentorship is a dieing art and seen by many as old fashioned as it gets. With the likes of YouTube, Twitter and Tiktok churning out entertaining but frankly skin deep content around all things dommery-fuckery in place of good well rounded study and tuition from an experianced hand - it's no doubt had an impact on how men perceive what a dom should be, how we should act, and what our values should reflect

Couple that with a slow but steady decline in man to man relationships generally (and I'm not talking a jolly with your mates at the pub) and you're left with an isolated, often lonley, generally well meaning and kink filled fantasy man with a heavily media biased mindsets based on entertainment kink porn and quick to burn-bright egos.

Like:
"If it aint now, it ain't fun and it ain't giving me kicks right now - I don't want anything to do with it."

Being a dom (to me) is about unboxing, honing and fine tuning yourself. Learning to understand and listen to all of my own and my partners desires, psychology, fantasy, techniques and intimacy. And learning to better or at least understand my own flaws too. Sure I love to let out my inner monster in the right setting but I do so with careful consideration and hopefully a little planning. I try to appreciate the nuance and subtlety of the smaller acts of love and kindness that hide behind the intentions of my own sadistic mind.

I really look forward to feeling confident and knowledgeable enough one day to offer my own mentorship to another. I still jave a lot to learn about myself before then.

I just hope the world we live in then isn't too fucked up and egotistical to accept the offer.

[Deleted Member]

12 minutes ago, KinkySirXxX said:

I can only comment (read 'rant') from my own perspective so forgive me if it offends... this is a can-o-worms type topic! Haha

I've spent many hours putting the World to rights over this very issue with others here. No other topic boils my piss quicker!

I couldn't agree more with your post @PaddyMaster and thank you for sharing It.

I think it has a lot to do with how men treat other men these days, perhaps more so than how they treat other women. Certainly in the UK in my own limmited experiance.

Mentorship is a dieing art and seen by many as old fashioned as it gets. With the likes of YouTube, Twitter and Tiktok churning out entertaining but frankly skin deep content around all things dommery-fuckery in place of good well rounded study and tuition from an experianced hand - it's no doubt had an impact on how men perceive what a dom should be, how we should act, and what our values should reflect

Couple that with a slow but steady decline in man to man relationships generally (and I'm not talking a jolly with your mates at the pub) and you're left with an isolated, often lonley, generally well meaning and kink filled fantasy man with a heavily media biased mindsets based on entertainment kink porn and quick to burn-bright egos.

Like:
"If it aint now, it ain't fun and it ain't giving me kicks right now - I don't want anything to do with it."

Being a dom (to me) is about unboxing, honing and fine tuning yourself. Learning to understand and listen to all of my own and my partners desires, psychology, fantasy, techniques and intimacy. And learning to better or at least understand my own flaws too. Sure I love to let out my inner monster in the right setting but I do so with careful consideration and hopefully a little planning. I try to appreciate the nuance and subtlety of the smaller acts of love and kindness that hide behind the intentions of my own sadistic mind.

I really look forward to feeling confident and knowledgeable enough one day to offer my own mentorship to another. I still jave a lot to learn about myself before then.

I just hope the world we live in then isn't too fucked up and egotistical to accept the offer.

I couldn't agree more @KinkySirXxX .. Many thanks for the additions and fine tunning of my post.