Knowing whose safe and whose not

[CopperKnob]

Its easy to know whose either not a real Dom or whose new and getting things wrong quite quickly, in the early stages of conversation but, when the individual is a master manipulator, is particularly good at gaslighting, how do you know?

I understand the need for vetting etc, but having been caught, what measures do other people take?
There has to be more than chatting, googling, a gut feeling? Or is there?

[Alpjumper]

Leave the toxic relationship.

[UK****]

Trust your gut.  Evolution has made us survive for a reason.

If you have doubts, they are very normally right.  Far often than not.

If they are a manipulator, then they will normally be good at covering their tracks.   Often though there will be subtle clues you pick up, often without realising exactly what it was.

[typhoon2]

Ask loaded questions, where you know what answer you want to hear. For instance, if tickling is a Hard Limit, one that you absolutely hate and will refuse to engage in, ask what they think about it. If they respond with 'We'll try it some time' or 'You don't know what you're missing' then that's a huge red flag - they're overruling your solid beliefs and pressing their own agenda. A decent Top or Dominant will make a note and agree to avoid it.

[TheBookCollector]

Its difficult, as master manipulators know what to say and how to give you the answer you want to hear. However they do lack consistency.

Ask about when a scene went wrong, ask what happened and how they managed the situation. Anyone with experience who claims not to have made any mistakes in a scene is lying. We've all made mistakes especially with rope.

Ask about the last relationship, write the info down then ask a week later. Is is consistent?

What does thier fetlife profile look like, do they have a good balance of local male/female friends across the D/s spectrum and age ranges,.or are they spread across the globe.

Be wary of people with 1000's of friends or that accept all friend requests.

Look at thier history, do thet just follow a type, what are thier writings like, (eg lots of caps,.rants, ravings) are they a member of local groups? What events are they attending?

Are they active on the groups they are members off?

Vetting can be difficult, contact local play events and munches ask if the member is on a banned list, if they are ask why. Then ask why they dont go to local events?

If they are local to you insist on meeting at a local munch.

Finally put on the cold hard logic hat, and look at what has been said, how they reacted to you arranging a meet for a coffee or lunch with no play on offer do they try to manipulate you? During the meal/coffee how do they treat the staff? Do they offer to split the bill or resolutly want to pay for everything?

[ey****]

some red flags can be in trying to isolate you.  Not everyone wants to be involved in a local community level, but if they stop (or monitor) you going online or to community events then they're often trying to keep you away from information.

anything also where they feel they're above learning.  no one knows everything.

there's some language which isn't necessarily manipulative, but can be, or can also show you're not a good match - anything where there is an insistence or obsession with pushing/breaking limits when you haven't expressly asked for this

any form of "real Dom" or "real sub" -esque language. 

[ey****]

oh, any anyone talking about the past.  we're not in the past any more - and in terms of world history, modern BDSM is very young (but, old enough that there's a lot of hazy pre/early internet recollections)

that there's stuff there's nothing wrong with - but anyone who is telling you "how it was" or "how it should be" or "tradition" - there may very well be truth in it - but put 2 people in a room and you'll get 3 different versions of history - you don't have to do things in line with any of them.

[Deleted Member]

I guess I'd divide it into two categories - one is the info I have about that person. Their profile(s), friends on kink sites, what they say and don't say, groups, events etc. I've noticed recently that it's the gaps that tell a story. On a site for a year but no friends. No male friends, doesn't follow males.
The second is their interactions with me. How they introduce themselves. Do they start demanding photos early on. Wanting to go off-site quickly. Talking about sex/kink - do they bring it up all the time. How do they respond when I say no to something. I think reactions are key. How someone reacts in a quick moving conversation - very telling.
Some of it now is just experience because guys have played me already. So my red flag o meter works better. My instincts are sharper and I listen to them.
Personally I've found having kinky friends that I trust hugely important. I will screenshot a conversation or describe it and get their opinion. I did this recently because I was bothered by something. Community matters when things are good and when things go wrong.

[TheBookCollector]

15 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

some red flags can be in trying to isolate you.  Not everyone wants to be involved in a local community level, but if they stop (or monitor) you going online or to community events then they're often trying to keep you away from information.

anything also where they feel they're above learning.  no one knows everything.

there's some language which isn't necessarily manipulative, but can be, or can also show you're not a good match - anything where there is an insistence or obsession with pushing/breaking limits when you haven't expressly asked for this

any form of "real Dom" or "real sub" -esque language. 

Agreed not everyone is involved in the local community, but how they react to you suggesting meeting at a local munch will speak volumes, these people cant help themselves telling others how bad the local kink community is, and how its full of ***rs.

[Mz****]

I agree with everything that's already been said..and it's been said so well I don't need to repeat it..I do have two tips not mentioned though..don't message on those apps that delete the messages..this helps you double check what you've said when someone is telling you that you're wrong or mistaken, it allows you to re read messages that may have been sent when you're sucked into the D/s gravitas moments, or horny moments, or been a little confused..and gives you evidence to fall back on if required. 

And secondly if you find yourself apologising when you haven't done or said anything wrong..thats a glaring red flag pointing directly at a gaslighter.

[ey****]

yep - anything you can refer back to is a plus.  

I won't say I was being gaslit, or manipulated - but - having some previous conversations helped me a lot when I was doubting myself on something.  (a kinda. was I unreasonable to get my hopes up, or, were things definitely said that gave me reason to have been disappointed when they didn't happen) and it's valuable if nothing else to validate yourself in a "No, I was right to feel that way" kinda thing. 

[CopperKnob]

Thank you all, appreciated

[CopperKnob]

I just saw this post pop up in the newsfeed. This 10months has flown by. It's nice to re visit this and to think about where I was a year ago to now.

[Catsailor69]

Tuesday at 12:42 PM, CopperKnob said:

I just saw this post pop up in the newsfeed. This 10months has flown by. It's nice to re visit this and to think about where I was a year ago to now.

CK, I agree. There are big differences as time and experiences grow. I keep a journal at least weekly adding entries. Looking back now at my own thoughts and perspectives, motives and experiences over years, do help in realizing that we do change and that change is possible.

[Ae****]

If you're getting caught by a master manipulator, look into your self, specifically your past. Your childhood. The answers and solution is there.

The reason you can't see the signs is that you're blind to them - but they are all there - in fact, that's why the master manipulator was attracted to you and why you were attracted to them. You pick up on eachothers subconscious signals. Neither of you is aware.

Locate the cause of the pattern seeking, process the issue, and subsequently romantic/relationship manipulation will always be obvious from a mile away.