Diffrence Between a Sub vs Slave?

[Deleted Member]

I don’t really get it, so I'd really appreciate it if someone could please explain it to me?

Thanks!

Edited July 24, 2018 by Deleted Member
Making sure others can understand what you mean :)

[Deleted Member]

I guess it's quite open to personal interpritation. Personally I'd say that your more likely to care for a sub and momenterally think of them, there feelings and needs before having your wicked way with them, deep down you need them and they need you. Slave on the other hand... use, abuse, neglect, unleash your deepest darkest desires on with little or no regard for them (within responsible limits of course!!) and if they keep coming back then you mustn't have scared or offended them enough.. so keep trying and see just how low they'll go

[sc****]

Type 'difference between a sub and a slave BDSM' into google. There is so much information on this subject in the first page : )

[BigPolly]

A sub will give their submission, have & discuss limits, has a safe word when limits are reached, has control over themselves as well as handing control to their Dom/Domme/Daddy & is very powerful when it comes to decision making. A slave is exactly what you think of a slave to be. They hand all control of their actions over to their owner, they hand over all control of their limits & hand all decisions to those in charge. They must obey totally at all times when required. They have no say on anything so must trust that their owner knows what is best for them both. It’s is a very extreme situation but like any kink some find it rewarding.

[Deleted Member]

BIgPolly sum up it all, I will just add that a slave is a very big responsibility and not for everybody, but then again its very rare to find one, specially here you won't! I will also rectify a comment here about abuse, neglect a slave? its nothing to do about it. Its about total submission and as such you care more. A slave might be masochist but in any way agreed to be abused, you got a wrond idea about bdsm.

[BigPolly]

However don’t take that as a sub is a soft option. Some play on a very extreme level it’s just we get to make that choice ourselves.

[Deleted Member]

Thanks @BigPolly@scarllett@FabSeverus and @mick2018

[saphy]

@mick2018....I'm actually sitting here completely and totally dumbfounded by what I just read on your comment. Evidently you do NOT have the slightest clue in what your talking about! I'm actually lost for words and desperately counting to ten!!!

[saphy]

3 hours ago, mick2018 said:

I guess it's quite open to personal interpritation. Personally I'd say that your more likely to care for a sub and momenterally think of them, there feelings and needs before having your wicked way with them, deep down you need them and they need you. Slave on the other hand... use, abuse, neglect, unleash your deepest darkest desires on with little or no regard for them (within responsible limits of course!!) and if they keep coming back then you mustn't have scared or offended them enough.. so keep trying and see just how low they'll go

After calming myself down and from instinctly responding I have decided that this is NOT the kind of attitude or behaviour that's acceptable and to be quite honest I would encourage all and any s type to stay well clear of you! That is an unbelievable concept to put forth as advice and it should not be acknowledged as such! Infact, it should be deleted and for this reason, I WILL be reporting said comment. You, @mick2018 are exactly what constitutes a red flag! 

[Deleted Member]

I was commenting based upon my own interpritation and experiences, my experience of being a dom is very limited to all but the most vanilla of play as I'm naturally more submissive and have previously been a sub. I've never been a slave, nor have I ever googled it as I've always seen it as exactly that, giving up your rights souly to be used abused and neglected, unlike a sub, who is cared about and has a mutual bond of meeting each others needs. I'm sorry my comment so very very offended everyone but at the end of the day it was my interpretation, not an absolute rule. You really don't need to go down the route of ranting and reporting me based on 1 comment on 1 post, your first response to this, along with the response from @FabSeverus would have been more than sufficient to correct me and re evaluate my perspective on an area I've never paid much attention to. I will try and work out how to remove the comment, I'm sorry for the offence caused.

Edited July 24, 2018 by Deleted Member

[ey****]

while there are differences - like a lot of titles they can be thrown around to fit the relationship rather than the reality.  

BigPolly's definition is pretty much the best.  

There is often a problem in the sense there's sub guys who claim they wish to be a slave in the hope it makes them more desirable (when they're barely submissive) and there's also Dominant guys who seek out slaves, rather than subs - because in their view it means they can pretty much do what they want.

I think a common guy fantasy is to be or have a sex slave - which is only really flirting around the edges.

[saphy]

Maybe my phone is a little screwy but after giving the definition you were after, it did not actually post 🤔

Edited July 24, 2018 by saphy

[saphy]

I think what would be a fantastic idea is that when someone posts on a forum asking for a definition or an explanation so that they can grow in their own understanding, AND for the benefit of those who also have little or no understanding then it SHOULD be factual points and advice that are given. 

This is a prime example of 'personal interpretation' gone wrong! 

Let's not cloud the minds of those 'learning' with fabricated nonsense. 

 

Personally, I have grew within my submission AND I have served as a slave...in both I have numerous years of experience. I have mentored subs and slaves alike, which would probably serve as a better understanding at my frustration, because what I saw in this post is PRECISELY what I advise girls to steer clear of. Under NO circumstances is abuse acceptable. NONE. No slave or submissive should ever be abused, given they are within a proper dynamic. 

A submissive, as others have rightly said, DO indeed have limits and are allowed to exercise them. They DO have a voice and safe words and are encouraged to use both they can also choose when and if they will submit. Submissives will typically not be in submission 24/7.

A slave on the other hand have no need for limits because they choose to be under His hand and at His mercy....this DOESN'T constitute abuse! An M/s dynamic portrays a solid foundation and an equal amount of trust and consideration to each others needs. A slave will not have a safe word because again, their purpose is solely at His desire and His will. A slave will usually commit to their Master 24/7, those who can't will accomodate Him because nothing means more to them than their servitude. 

BOTH submissive and slave have the right and the expectation to be nurtured and taken care of whilst in submission or servitude. 

This should (and typically is) the basis of any dynamic and there is always a firm understanding and/or connection there that both are mutually consenting of. 

This is very basic knowledge and I'm sure (or hope) that it carves a path to a better understanding. 

Blessed be. 

Edited July 24, 2018 by saphy

[Deleted Member]

submissive has free will and may choose to answer his/Her submissive yearnings, a slave gives up their rights and depends on their Owner to maximize their property value/encourage them to live beyond their servitude. A submissive usually returns to normal vanilla life after the play/scene is over where a slave is lost deep within HEADSPACE long after and would need counseling to escape BDSM as a way of life. Lots of subs get off on the painful pleasure of pretending to be a slave but real slaves know they have no desire outside of their Owner's pleasure

[BigPolly]

9 hours ago, bingobaby said:

and would need counseling to escape BDSM as a way of life

🤦🏻‍♀️ *shakes head

[Jed]

20 hours ago, mick2018 said:

I guess it's quite open to personal interpritation. Personally I'd say that your more likely to care for a sub and momenterally think of them, there feelings and needs before having your wicked way with them, deep down you need them and they need you. Slave on the other hand... use, abuse, neglect, unleash your deepest darkest desires on with little or no regard for them (within responsible limits of course!!) and if they keep coming back then you mustn't have scared or offended them enough.. so keep trying and see just how low they'll go

Needless to say your knowledge needs to improve before you add in to any post on here...the damage that comments like that can do don't bare thinking About!!!!!

Please seek advice before posting on subject matter in future!!!

[Jed]

11 hours ago, bingobaby said:

where a slave is lost deep within HEADSPACE long after and would need counseling to escape BDSM as a way of life. 

Again your knowledge is rather poor and you really need to refrain from making generalised statements on a post which will impact others. Seek advice or drastically improve on you knowledge base first before adding to other posts.

[Deleted Member]

4 hours ago, Jed said:

Again your knowledge is rather poor and you really need to refrain from making generalised statements on a post which will impact others. Seek advice or drastically improve on you knowledge base first before adding to other posts.

***WARNING*** troll stuff above^^^ 

What is your basis for contradiction? I, on the other hand have personal experience as both. Guru Jed ^^^ as yet is unaware of my knowledge, mostly because of your determination to be an authority ----additionally failing to make inquiry.

 Acceptance of slavery by the slave- results in several dependencies and WILL NEED COUNSELING to revert or convert upon emancipation.

Anyone who would diminish psych-therapy(or counseling) ^^^ for a slave who is moving on from the life of slavery, is not conscious of their slave's holistic health and should be AVOIDED by the prospective slave.

"slavery is exactly what you think it would be" Big Polly

Be aware we have very contemporary examples of the result of slavery outside of BDSM, although I speak from the perspective of 17 years of BDSM growing up in an era where it was easily accessible for my entire life.

I can't speak for the elder era that they^^^ experienced.

Edited July 25, 2018 by Deleted Member

[saphy]

 

25 minutes ago, bingobaby said:

***WARNING*** troll stuff above^^^ 

What is your basis for contradiction? I, on the other hand have personal experience as both. Guru Jed ^^^ as yet is unaware of my knowledge, mostly because of your determination to be an authority ----additionally failing to make inquiry.

 Acceptance of slavery by the slave- results in several dependencies and WILL NEED COUNSELING to revert or convert upon emancipation.

Anyone who would diminish psych-therapy(or counseling) ^^^ for a slave who is moving on from the life of slavery, is not conscious of their slave's holistic health and should be AVOIDED by the prospective slave.

"slavery is exactly what you think it would be" Big Polly

Be aware we have very contemporary examples of the result of slavery outside of BDSM, although I speak from the perspective of 17 years of BDSM growing up in an era where it was easily accessible for my entire life.

I can't speak for the elder era that they^^^ experienced.

For the record, I AM His and can assure that having personal experience of owning a sub/slave He is well aware of what He's saying and condoning. 

Being a slave does NOT mean that they at any point  (as you stated) would "NEED" counseling or psych-therapy, I for one am testament to that fact. So when my Sir says that you need to not generalise and state things as factual that isn't factual at all then He's giving you some very worthwhile advice. 

Furthermore, He isn't and doesn't claim or strive to be an authority toward any one else, He is quite matter of fact in how He portrays Himself and that's because He is a seasoned Dominant. If you can't appreciate that, then that's on you....it doesn't then mean that you attempt to slander a Dominant for giving His advice.....Considering your 17 years background thats quite a condescending attitude to have in my opinion. 

Just take or leave the advice as it was intended and don't take it as a personal attack.....i'll be sure to apologise on your behalf for such a poor attitude. *smh*

[saphy]

@bingobaby

Thinking outside the box here...if someone was to read the comment about NEEDING counselling or psych therapy if ever they were slave that could be extremely detrimental to their mindset and would set them up to fail. Something, as a community, we don't wish to encourage. We're here to raise each another up not be the cause of people stressing over things that aren't accurate. 

If however YOU needed psych therapy or counselling, then I'm glad you received the help you needed for your own situation. But not everyone is made the same way. It would be good to remember that. 

[Deleted Member]

9 minutes ago, saphy said:

Being a slave does NOT mean that they at any point  (as you stated) would "NEED" counseling or psych-therapy, I for one am testament to that fact. So when my Sir says that you need to not generalise and state things as factual that isn't factual at all then He's giving you some very worthwhile advice. 

 

as his "slave"? of HIS wife girlfriend... im confused as to the extent of your declaration.. with respects to my facts.

Its important to note he invalidly stated that i lacked knowledge of what I was speaking.

Its important to note ***saphy*** jsut gave me an order, seems inconsistent with slavery..

Also noted is that **saphy** ALSO failed to comprehend that i was referencing a slave who will be moving on from their BDSM lifestyle and the slave's absolute NEEDS(for counseling to accomplish that) in contrast with a sub's general LACK of need when moving on from a scene back to his Vanilla life.

So the question is does ***saphy want to return to a life outside of being property??

[Deleted Member]

13 minutes ago, saphy said:

@bingobaby

Thinking outside the box here...if someone was to read the comment about "NEEDING counselling or psych therapy if ever they were slave" that could be extremely detrimental to their mindset and would set them up to fail.

My words were not "NEEDING counselling or psych therapy if ever they were slave" Those were sub *saphy's words

mine were a comparison between the options a sUB has when returning to Vanilla life, that a sLAVE lacks upon emancipation.

 

Edited July 25, 2018 by Deleted Member

[Jed]

3 minutes ago, bingobaby said:

***WARNING*** troll stuff above^^^ 

What is your basis for contradiction? I, on the other hand have personal experience as both. Guru Jed ^^^ as yet is unaware of my knowledge, mostly because of your determination to be an authority ----additionally failing to make inquiry.

 Acceptance of slavery by the slave- results in several dependencies and WILL NEED COUNSELING to revert or convert upon emancipation.

Anyone who would diminish psych-therapy(or counseling) ^^^ for a slave who is moving on from the life of slavery, is not conscious of their slave's holistic health and should be AVOIDED by the prospective slave.

"slavery is exactly what you think it would be" Big Polly

Be aware we have very contemporary examples of the result of slavery outside of BDSM, although I speak from the perspective of 17 years of BDSM growing up in an era where it was easily accessible for my entire life.

I can't speak for the elder era that they^^^ experienced.

Two things to point out @bingobaby one I don't troll....as a member on this site I'm entitled to respond to any post I seem fit....and I take the opportunity to readily do that when the information that's relayed is either detrimental to the good of the community or the post is providing misinformed opinion.

Secondly I have been in a dynamic with a very well respected lady who is Kajira trained and has trained many others in this form....her knowledge base far exceeds many and all in here and I can quite happily say that what your perception  of what a slave needs to move from one position to another is so wrong....in fact it's rather detrimental to anyone reading this post.

I have built a very healthy knowledge base from my years in Lifestyle....you on the other hand seem to be quoting from resources unknown to better suit your own position.

Maybe spending sometime reflecting on the true meanings and values to which most of us hold very dear will enlighten you.

[Deleted Member]

24 minutes ago, Jed said:

@bingobaby

Secondly I have been in a dynamic with a very well respected lady who is Kajira trained and has trained many others in this form....her knowledge base far exceeds many and all in here and I can quite happily say that what your perception  of what a slave needs to move from one position to another is so wrong....in fact it's rather detrimental to anyone reading this post.

You have yet to make an argument- just brandishing a false judgment, and have yet to reference a slave who is moving on from slavery. And contrasting that with a submissive moving on from a scene or segment of co-determined servitude.

FACT: a submissive has options, and in comparison looses very little independence, and can make a relatively easy return to Vanilla life, you can perform submisson on your lunch-break at work.

A REAL slave can't just shake it off the way **saphy did when she gave me orders and made the ad-hominem assertions she did in defense of her _______ .... still not sure what Jed is to her...

If an actual slave reading this decides you do not want to be a slave any longer, please know you WILL NEED COUNSELING and there is nothing wrong with that. IF you do not need counseling you likely were not truly anyone's property or not for very long.

Edited July 25, 2018 by Deleted Member

[saphy]

@bingobaby

Number one. I can't recall at ANY point giving you ANY order. 

Secondly, you didn't reference any one particular slave...you generalised and therein lies the issue. What was quite evidently playing out in your head didn't quite make it onto the screen and that's the only detrimental fact that was pointed out to you. 

To add to that, we

28 minutes ago, bingobaby said:

You have yet to make an argument- just brandishing a false judgment, and have yet to reference a slave who is moving on from slavery. And contrasting that with a submissive moving on from a scene or segment of co-determined servitude.

FACT: a submissive has options, and in comparison looses very little independence, and can make a relatively easy return to Vanilla life, you can perform submisson on your lunch-break at work.

A REAL slave can't just shake it off the way **saphy did when she gave me orders and made the ad-hominem assertions she did in defense of her _______ .... still not sure what Jed is to her...

If an actual slave reading this decides you do not want to be a slave any longer, please know you WILL NEED COUNSELING and there is nothing wrong with that. IF you do not need counseling you likely were not truly anyone's property or not for very long.

AGAIN....i will point out that you are admonishing the slave lifestyle by STATING (IN CAPS) that a slave WILL NEED COUNSELLING. just because you clearly do doesn't mean that EVERY slave does. 

I spent years as a slave, I was kajira trained by Gorean Masters and I have been able to leave my servitude behind me to embrace my submissiveness once again. During that period of time, FACT.....I DID return to vanilla life and stepped away from the lifestyle before engaging in my current D/s dynamic WITHOUT COUNSELLING OR PSYCH THERAPY....to clarify, Jed, is my Sir. 

So there is someone reading this who IS educated first hand on the topic and that would be me....and contrary to your belief, I served for years as such and I dont think you will find someone more "true" to being someone's property, than someone who spent three years in a 24/7 dynamic. 

Finally I will say, that you seem quite an angered and destructive soul and I'm sorry you've been damaged by your experiences to behave in such a manner, servitude as slave is a beautiful lifestyle and one I hold dearly but it can have its adverse effects so, because I am unaware of the extent that you've been affected, I'm going to cease interacting with you here, for your own benefit. I wouldnt wish to have you struggle moreso with your demons. 

I will however wish you well on your paths and I won't hold a grudge or reflect in any way on what's been said here. There's alot of assuming going on now and that's NOT the purpose of the post. 

Be blessed. 

Edited July 25, 2018 by saphy