Safety and Respect

[TheZenCommander]

22 hours ago, Shilo66 said:

LOL, you have consistently strongly implied that Clare's Law is not very effective... your statements are still there for ALL to read. 

Trying to back peddle now is not going to cut any ice with anyone.

Obviously, I don't mind conversations like these, because it means that more and more people, will look up Clare's Law just to see what all the fuss is about. And of the people who will look it up, will be those who will find it useful either for themselves, or, for some people they know.  

LOL, despite your best attempts, you have inadvertently helped to spread the word about Clare's Law, so I thank you. 

And, you really should do your research before commenting and making yourself look, erm... the way you're looking now... 

You see, the VAWG you talk about, and your other statement that women and g1rls voices are not being listened to... Clare's law is a direct response to that.

The clue is in the name... CLARE'S LAW, not Fred's law or David's law, but CLARE'S!!!

Clare's Law was spear-headed by her mom, after her daughter, Clare, was unalived by her (Clare's) partner who had convictions for SA and DV. 

Clare's mom argued that had her daaaughter known about them, she would have left him. Other women who had also been veectims of SA and DV, came forward with the same complaint that they should have been told about such histories. You know why?.. BECAUSE AT THAT TIME, the police and other law enfourcement agencies were not allowed to divulge such information. Clare's mom, along with other campaainers, fought long and hard to get this exception to the law made. 

So, what was it you were saying about women and g1rls voices not being heard???????? 

 

 

  

Let me say something that might help.....

People should report, AND reporting is not effective enough to be the whole solution to the problem. Both are true.

You're failing to hear or acknowledge the experience of people who have lived it.

[Shilo66]

@TheZenCommander again, you are incorrect. This was the original question. 

On 5/1/2026 at 6:50 PM, M134 said:

What do men do to address our rampant culture of domestic vi@lence? 

I, because I'm a man, then replied that we can make more people aware of CLARE'S LAW. A Law in the UK specifically designed to address this very issue of DV and SA.

Whereas, you, didn’t even try to supply a realistic, practical, or workable suggestion or solution, like I did.

Solutions wise, the best you and @AKA_Copper could come up with, was to say that "men should behave better." Basically, just a wish.

All you've done on this thread, is rant, vent, made insinuations, cast aspersions, and 'put-down' all of the realistic and practical ways mentioned to address the OP's original question. Whilst at the same time, have offered nothing of your own that's even remotely workable, logical...or realistic.

So, given all the above, how on earth do you expect your 'wish' to come true!?

You've gone on about reporting not being enough, but have consistently  failed to suggest any other way a SA or DV problem could be recognised in the eyes of the law.

The law, in whatever country, isn't going to just act on your 'say-so' about a subject. It needs reports, proof and evidence, otherwise without these, how is it LEGALLY supposed to see that there's a problem? Without these, how is it supposed to get convictions?

 

On 5/6/2026 at 2:03 PM, TheZenCommander said:

 

[M1****]

Yesterday at 01:13 AM, TheZenCommander said:

Sending so much love and healing to you. What a terrible tragedy. I'm so sorry for your loss.

Thank you. Im struggling bad atm and am falling apart. Im getting there

[FE****]

Mod Note:

Despite previous warnings, people are still trying to dig at each other rather than have a constructive debate.

I removed certain sections of some recent posts (trying to leave in the substantive elements whilst removing the jibes and insults) on both sides.

This is the final warning, argue your points but don't get into personal insults or your posts will be removed and escalations actioned.

[AKA_Copper]

22 hours ago, Shilo66 said:

@TheZenCommander again, you are incorrect. This was the original question. 

Jo Shaw' ex ***d his way into her house with an explosive device which went off. They both d1ed.
The case has been referred to the IOPC wanna know why? Jo had been reporting to the police the DA incidents she had been experiencing with him for a long time. Theybwere both well known to the authorities. This was after she'd left the relationship, changed her phone number and moved address. She subsequently reported that she beleived that he was trying to harm her.
The police took no action.
So you can tell us to make use of Clares law, leave a DA relationship, got to an IDVA/Police and get a non mole , do this, do that. Women are still dy1ng despite doing everything right.

How many arrests have been made following CNN's report on one global r@pe academy? Is the website still up and running with that particular area of it active? Rhetorical, I know the answers.

We report and we aren't beleived as evidenced by one victim whose husband drugg3d and then r@ped her was told by the police - Well, we can't use that, that isn't clear evidence, because it looks like you're pretending to be asleep.’

Let's not forget the Rotherham grooming gang which went on for decades with numerous agencies being aware of what was happening (you can read the Jay report) but those in positions to do something about it framed the situation as the g1rls being sex workers, undesirables and being blamed for the cr1mes committed against them with professionals suggesting that the g1rls were consenting to the r@pe. A reminder that all those involved (other than the perpetrators) were minors and unable to consent legally.

These are not isolated incidents but a recurring systemic problem.

You can shout as much as youbwant avout all the things women and g1rls can do to keep ourselves safe. We already know them because we're told about them from an early age. They're ingrained in us.

We can report but, unless we're the perfect v1ctim, there won't be a Charge brought.

This does not change until men decide to change. Until the decent men out there speak up and challenge those that aren't which is literally the point of the OP. Until VAWG is actually a priority for govts. laws and systems are changed and women are believed.

[Fl****]

There must be consent by both parties w a very detailed conversation about the situation and circumstances to a great detail and mutual agreement between both parties must be there and clearly communicated. Without having that it could be misinterpreted or misunderstood by either of you and may be *** in its truest form. Which is why as a Dom male I find it very interesting so many wanna have these discussions online and be treated like a slut without having those discussions about the details and circumstances at hand. I understand it’s all in fun but you’re allowing people to do things to you online that you’d never allow in real life then you’re kidding yourself because you’re telling men it’s okay. When they meet someone in real life they do what they’ve learned here then they find themselves in trouble so I’d say treat them equally and hold them to the same standards on both counts. Just my 2 cents

[TheZenCommander]

11 hours ago, FloridaSunandGun said:

There must be consent by both parties w a very detailed conversation about the situation and circumstances to a great detail and mutual agreement between both parties must be there and clearly communicated. Without having that it could be misinterpreted or misunderstood by either of you and may be *** in its truest form. Which is why as a Dom male I find it very interesting so many wanna have these discussions online and be treated like a slut without having those discussions about the details and circumstances at hand. I understand it’s all in fun but you’re allowing people to do things to you online that you’d never allow in real life then you’re kidding yourself because you’re telling men it’s okay. When they meet someone in real life they do what they’ve learned here then they find themselves in trouble so I’d say treat them equally and hold them to the same standards on both counts. Just my 2 cents

I think you severely underestimate the amount of men on here that pretend to be women.

But also, there is NOTHING A WOMAN CAN SAY OR DO OR WEAR THAT JUSTIFIES ASS4ULT! Period.

If you believe that being vocally sexual in what they think is a safe place is a reason for vi0lence, then you too are part of the problem.

[Shilo66]

On 5/8/2026 at 12:15 AM, AKA_Copper said:

This does not change until men decide to change. Until the decent men out there speak up and challenge those that aren't which is literally the point of the OP. 

The 'decent men out there,' have been speaking up and challenging those that aren't for a while now... It's just that some women have simply chosen not to recognise their efforts.

The mother of the woman who the DVDS is named after, CLARE'S LAW, didn’t just sit around moaning that it's 'all mens' fault', and that 'men should do better'. She didn't sit around and say 'it's not our job'. Instead, she made sure that the deeath of her daughter at the hands of a man who had convictions for SA and DV, would not be in vane.

HENCE, why SHE pushed to ensure that an exception in the law was made whereby women and others, would have the right to be told if their partner or ex partner had a history of SA and/or DV.

As a result, very many women HAVE  BEEN SAVED from becoming veectims of a SA and DV, BECAUSE they used CLARE'S LAW.

We've even had a lady on this very thread, testify how it saved her from becoming a potential next veectim.

It's all too easy to criticize when there is no intention to try and improve upon a situation, or, contribute in a positive way to the effort.

Just think, if this topic hadn't been derailed, there could've been some good suggestions that could have gone on to be genuinely good workable and viable ideas. Instead, here we are.

For 'decent men', when we can't directly protect those we care about, we do the next best thing, we give and we share tools and information that they can use to protect themselves. One of them, being Clare's Law. It's not perfect, but it's more effective than just wishing for change.

 

 

Edited May 9 by Shilo66

[AKA_Copper]

14 hours ago, Shilo66 said:

The 'decent men out there,' have been speaking up and challenging those that aren't for a while now... It's just that some women have simply chosen not to recognise their efforts.

The mother of the woman who the DVDS is named after, CLARE'S LAW, didn’t just sit around moaning that it's 'all mens' fault', and that 'men should do better'. She didn't sit around and say 'it's not our job'. Instead, she made sure that the deeath of her daughter at the hands of a man who had convictions for SA and DV, would not be in vane.

HENCE, why SHE pushed to ensure that an exception in the law was made whereby women and others, would have the right to be told if their partner or ex partner had a history of SA and/or DV.

As a result, very many women HAVE  BEEN SAVED from becoming veectims of a SA and DV, BECAUSE they used CLARE'S LAW.

We've even had a lady on this very thread, testify how it saved her from becoming a potential next veectim.

It's all too easy to criticize when there is no intention to try and improve upon a situation, or, contribute in a positive way to the effort.

Just think, if this topic hadn't been derailed, there could've been some good suggestions that could have gone on to be genuinely good workable and viable ideas. Instead, here we are.

For 'decent men', when we can't directly protect those we care about, we do the next best thing, we give and we share tools and information that they can use to protect themselves. One of them, being Clare's Law. It's not perfect, but it's more effective than just wishing for change.

 

 

As i previously asked, how many women and g1rls have you supported through DA, SA and VAWG?

Its literally my job and has been for the past 18yrs. In addition to being a women, thats what makes me educated enough on the subject to be able to voice the reality of everything you deny.

[ey****]

On 5/8/2026 at 12:15 AM, AKA_Copper said:

How many arrests have been made following CNN's report on one global r@pe academy? Is the website still up and running with that particular area of it active? Rhetorical, I know the answers.

it is finally down and charges are starting

however...... like a lot of tube, pirate, etc sites a lot of this content was there, and there for years.  I'm not saying this is ok, the opposite in fact.  They also weren't the only guilty website - I treat folk who rave about (fuck it, I'll name it) pornhub with deep suspicions because for the longest time they were extremely slack on content which shouldn't be there, including stuff where one or more parties did not consent to the act, being filmed, etc.  only 2022 they started to take it seriously and only because the card companies threatened to do list them.    I also extend some of this distrust to people who access pirate content in general 

[Shilo66]

7 hours ago, AKA_Copper said:

As i previously asked, how many women and g1rls have you supported through DA, SA and VAWG?

I've supported quite a few in my time, because it was a part of my job role.

Hence, my display of pretty extensive knowledge on the subject, and CLARE'S LAW in particular. A diligent person would have picked up on this and realised that I had more than just a "passing interest".

The women I worked with in the female refuge / safe space arena, are NOT man-haters, and as a result, were able to form many useful connections and networks. This resulted in some very innovative and well received awareness, targeted and educational campaaigns about VAWG, SA and DV. 

If they saw this thread, they would be horrified at the high jacking and wasted opportunity to get men to talk freely about the topic of VAWG and how they could counteract it. In fact, they would see it as very, very counterproductive.

You see, their approach is to bring people INTO the conversation, NOT to alienate them out, which is probably part of the reason why they're so successful when others, clearly aren't.

Edited May 10 by Shilo66
Remove excess spacing

[AKA_Copper]

Sunday at 02:47 AM, Shilo66 said:

I've supported quite a few in my time, because it was a part of my job role.

Hence, my display of pretty extensive knowledge on the subject, and CLARE'S LAW in particular. A diligent person would have picked up on this and realised that I had more than just a "passing interest".

The women I worked with in the female refuge / safe space arena, are NOT man-haters, and as a result, were able to form many useful connections and networks. This resulted in some very innovative and well received awareness, targeted and educational campaaigns about VAWG, SA and DV. 

If they saw this thread, they would be horrified at the high jacking and wasted opportunity to get men to talk freely about the topic of VAWG and how they could counteract it. In fact, they would see it as very, very counterproductive.

You see, their approach is to bring people INTO the conversation, NOT to alienate them out, which is probably part of the reason why they're so successful when others, clearly aren't.

There's a lot of assumptions there.

What your experience should provide you is with an ability to see that with every positive is a/are negative/s and that nothing is black and white.

When someone as passionate as Jess Philips resigns from her post as the Safeguarding Minister calling out a lack of action/boldness of her Govt. You start to realise VAWG is on no ones agenda as a priority than those that live it.

[AKA_Copper]

Saturday at 09:02 PM, eyemblacksheep said:

it is finally down and charges are starting

however...... like a lot of tube, pirate, etc sites a lot of this content was there, and there for years.  I'm not saying this is ok, the opposite in fact.  They also weren't the only guilty website - I treat folk who rave about (fuck it, I'll name it) pornhub with deep suspicions because for the longest time they were extremely slack on content which shouldn't be there, including stuff where one or more parties did not consent to the act, being filmed, etc.  only 2022 they started to take it seriously and only because the card companies threatened to do list them.    I also extend some of this distrust to people who access pirate content in general 

Absolutely, its been there for decades, hidden only accessed by those looking for it. In its place a number more will be created purely because of the media attention received putting ideas in to people's minds as to how depraved they can be and get away with it

[Bu****]

The easiest way to combat it would be to just talk about it. Normalize men holding their ***rs accountable for what is called, Locker Room talk. Too many men brush off comments that promote, encourage, or joke about misogyny, DV, and SA instead of addressing it.

[Bu****]

1 minute ago, ButteredBiscuit said:

The easiest way to combat it would be to just talk about it. Normalize men holding their ***rs accountable for what is called, Locker Room talk. Too many men brush off comments that promote, encourage, or joke about misogyny, DV, and SA instead of addressing it.

P e e r s*

[Shilo66]

6 hours ago, AKA_Copper said:

 

There's a lot of assumptions there.

What your experience should provide you is with an ability to see that with every positive is a/are negative/s and that nothing is black and white.

When someone as passionate as Jess Philips resigns from her post as the Safeguarding Minister calling out a lack of action/boldness of her Govt. You start to realise VAWG is on no ones agenda as a priority than those that live it.

Simply type into Google, the following very simple phrase: Is Clare's Law successful in the West Midlands.

The answer will be YES. And, it will give the stats (a dirty word for some), the volumes, and the reasons why.

You see, up in my neck of the woods, we encourage our women folk not to be punch bags AND CRUCIALLY, not to let perpetrators get away with stuff. So it's no surprise that CLARE'S LAW works well up here!

Maybe, you should contact your equivalents up here and take some lessons... that is, if you really want to make things better for your clientèle.

It is a well known fact that just making a noise with no actual attempt to bring about change, clearly doesn't work.

No doubt there'll be no forthcoming apology or conceding to THESE DOCUMENTED FACTS, just more 'whataboutery', and more high jacking. 

---------------------------------------------------

Because I know some people do not want others to see those facts and figures, I've taken the liberty of posting some of them here... You're welcome.

==================

The following is what you'll see when you do that Google search:

Clare’s Law (Domestic *** Disclosure Scheme) is considered highly active and successful in the West Midlands, with thousands of households using it to check partners' violent histories. Data indicates a major rise in disclosures, helping to protect people at risk. 

Key Success Factors and Data (2025–2026):

High Usage: In 2025, West Midlands Police reported over 5,500 applications. In 2024, there was a 39% increase in warnings issued.

"Right to Know" and "Right to Ask": Police, in early 2026, were processing thousands of requests to proactively disclose information or answer enquiries from concerned citizens.

Preventative Impact: The law is credited with helping individuals identify abusive partners who lied about their past, allowing victims to take action to secure their safety.

 

 

Edited May 13 by Shilo66

[AKA_Copper]

16 hours ago, Shilo66 said:

Simply type into Google, the following very simple phrase: Is Clare's Law successful in the West Midlands.

The answer will be YES. And, it will give the stats (a dirty word for some), the volumes, and the reasons why.

You see, up in my neck of the woods, we encourage our women folk not to be punch bags AND CRUCIALLY, not to let perpetrators get away with stuff. So it's no surprise that CLARE'S LAW works well up here!

Maybe, you should contact your equivalents up here and take some lessons... that is, if you really want to make things better for your clientèle.

It is a well known fact that just making a noise with no actual attempt to bring about change, clearly doesn't work.

No doubt there'll be no forthcoming apology or conceding to THESE DOCUMENTED FACTS, just more 'whataboutery', and more high jacking. 

---------------------------------------------------

Because I know some people do not want others to see those facts and figures, I've taken the liberty of posting some of them here... You're welcome.

==================

The following is what you'll see when you do that Google search:

Clare’s Law (Domestic *** Disclosure Scheme) is considered highly active and successful in the West Midlands, with thousands of households using it to check partners' violent histories. Data indicates a major rise in disclosures, helping to protect people at risk. 

Key Success Factors and Data (2025–2026):

High Usage: In 2025, West Midlands Police reported over 5,500 applications. In 2024, there was a 39% increase in warnings issued.

"Right to Know" and "Right to Ask": Police, in early 2026, were processing thousands of requests to proactively disclose information or answer enquiries from concerned citizens.

Preventative Impact: The law is credited with helping individuals identify abusive partners who lied about their past, allowing victims to take action to secure their safety.

 

 

It’s rather revealing that, despite claiming experience working with women fleeing domestic *** in a refuge setting, your contribution to a discussion explicitly asking what men should be doing differently to combat VAWG was to immediately redirect responsibility back onto women with one, sole solution.

You could have chosen to share your 3rd hand experience. Your could have advocated on behalf of women. You could have made suggestions on how men can make changes. You could have taken shared accountability.

You simply added another reminder for women to modify themselves, restrict themselves, monitor themselves and take yet another precaution in a society where women have already been conditioned to do exactly that for generations.


To circle back, the entire point of the OP was asking how men examine and modify their own behaviour, attitudes and ***r culture, not how women can continue carrying the burden of prevention against someone elses behaviour while you, and other men remain comfortable, passive observers.

For someone positioning themselves as informed through professional experience, your response is less insightful than I imagine you believe it to be and yet another example of how deeply ingrained it is for men to centre women’s behaviour even in conversations specifically about male *** and a lack of accountability.

[lo****]

22 hours ago, Shilo66 said:

Simply type into Google, the following very simple phrase: Is Clare's Law successful in the West Midlands.

The answer will be YES. And, it will give the stats (a dirty word for some), the volumes, and the reasons why.

You see, up in my neck of the woods, we encourage our women folk not to be punch bags AND CRUCIALLY, not to let perpetrators get away with stuff. So it's no surprise that CLARE'S LAW works well up here!

Maybe, you should contact your equivalents up here and take some lessons... that is, if you really want to make things better for your clientèle.

It is a well known fact that just making a noise with no actual attempt to bring about change, clearly doesn't work.

No doubt there'll be no forthcoming apology or conceding to THESE DOCUMENTED FACTS, just more 'whataboutery', and more high jacking. 

---------------------------------------------------

Because I know some people do not want others to see those facts and figures, I've taken the liberty of posting some of them here... You're welcome.

==================

The following is what you'll see when you do that Google search:

Clare’s Law (Domestic *** Disclosure Scheme) is considered highly active and successful in the West Midlands, with thousands of households using it to check partners' violent histories. Data indicates a major rise in disclosures, helping to protect people at risk. 

Key Success Factors and Data (2025–2026):

High Usage: In 2025, West Midlands Police reported over 5,500 applications. In 2024, there was a 39% increase in warnings issued.

"Right to Know" and "Right to Ask": Police, in early 2026, were processing thousands of requests to proactively disclose information or answer enquiries from concerned citizens.

Preventative Impact: The law is credited with helping individuals identify abusive partners who lied about their past, allowing victims to take action to secure their safety.

 

 

I find it really interesting all you "contribute" to this conversation is "CLARE's LAW!!!"

I think you either are a troll, or not getting that you're not being effective.

MEN need to do something about this, because the problematic men don't even see women as people so won't listen to them. THIS is really the core of what needs to change.

When a guy in a social setting says something "joking" about DV, incest, SA, etc. They need called on it. Told that's not ok.

This "male loneliness epidemic" is self inflicted. Every day that goes by more and more things like the academy and more files are discovered/reported on/released. We see more and more men online talking about ways to *** women, manipulate them, etc.

The call is coming from inside the house.