I don't submit because I need therapy/guidance, D/s is not therapy

[CopperKnob]

In response to @Riccar56's 'Alphasub' post and those who validated that line of thinking - that D/s equates to therapy.

I mean, if you are a Dom who is also a TRAINED Therapist then 👏👏👏👏 but honestly, give me a damn break 🙄

For those doms that aren't but believe and continue to spout such shit, or attempt to tell us subs why we submit, repeat after me:

"I'm a mansplaining internet troll called Sweetheart."

I can’t bear the idea of a man using his dominance to teach me how to live my personal life, no matter how many kinky fairy lights and sparkles you dress it up in. When a man expects to take me on a journey of healing through kink, I want to hide under my desk, or, being the 'alpha' sub I am, punch him in the face. The very idea of therapy through kink is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I’d sooner eat a jar of pickles because, kink is not therapy and dammit, I am not a damsel in distress.

I don’t submit because I need guidance. On the contrary, I submit because I don’t need guidance. I already have the strength to give up control. I already have the resources to live my life well, and I don’t need a Dom to provide or replace them thank you very much. The only reason I can explore the darkness is because i’ve already overcome it.

There are subs who use submission to escape their power for a while. This is not therapy. There are subs who use it to demonstrate their power. This is also not therapy. I’m a sub because power exchange fascinates me. When I offer you my submission, I come to you not only as an equal but I come to you whole and I believe that the vast majority of our community’s subs are just as equally healthy and whole. Assuming we all need to be taught how to live is a failure to understand who we are, how dangerous submission really is. It takes courage, fortitude, and trust in our own competence to be able to give up control and survive it.

Impermanence is the nature of the vast majority of relationships, and if I didn’t have my strength, I might get lost in a D/s dynamic and never find my way out. I would be too terrified to submit if I was still struggling to figure out how to exist happily in the world.

When my first dynamic ended, the only way I knew to cope with the loss was to keep our protocols because our dynamic had leaked into every millimetre of my life. It was exquisite while it lasted, but the struggle to find a space that belonged only to me made the grief difficult to tolerate. I couldn’t get away from him for a second even though he was no longer there. The stain of him had seeped into every millisecond of my life. This is the danger of submission, it has the potential to damage a subs mental and emotional health, not the opposite. I had to find a way to heal myself and I did. I didn't jump into another dynamic wanting or needing a Dom to heal me. I, like many many other subs healed myself, alone.

The only reason I can even think of having a dynamic again is because I’ve found my peronal power not because I need a Dom to 'fix' me. Submission is like jumping off a cliff. It's not something you do unless you know you have the wings to fly. It certainly isn't because we're some weak individual that needs a white knight or even because it's our 'downtime' let alone because we need a therapist who we can't or don't want to pay for.

[Sir-Taz]

Hahahahahahahahah😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂

[Deleted Member]

I missed the original post, but seriously, if there are "Doms" spouting that shit then they need to be reported/outed or flogged...whichever makes the greatest impact. I shouted at one of my friends in here yesterday because she also had encountered a "Dom Therapist" who was "helping" her come to terms with her personal life. I am now going to ask his name...that will be interesting.

[Sasuke-1]

🤍

[TheBookCollector]

👏👏 well said. if you need therapy seek out a professional therapist. BDSM is not about calming your own personal demons its about letting go and opening yourself to another person on a level we rarely do in any other relationships.

[Leisa]

1 hour ago, TheScribe said:

I missed the original post, but seriously, if there are "Doms" spouting that shit then they need to be reported/outed or flogged...whichever makes the greatest impact. I shouted at one of my friends in here yesterday because she also had encountered a "Dom Therapist" who was "helping" her come to terms with her personal life. I am now going to ask his name...that will be interesting.

@Riccar56 was who spouted off that vile diatribe. What’s even more disturbing is that others who call themselves a D type subscribed to it. As an “Alpha” who just so happens to have many layers it was offensive and disturbing. Not so much for myself and my ***/brother subs who are also alpha, aka strong, independent, beautiful, and glorious but for those subs who have not yet found their footing to be completely comfortable and confident themselves. For those Doms just starting off who may read that shit and think we should revert back to June Cleaver days where Stepford Wives were the norm. It’s a dangerous posting and probably should not be on this forum where it can definitely do more harm then good.

You hit another out of the park Copperknob. Thank you for putting my outrage and disgust so eloquently.

[Deleted Member]

No idea about the other post being referred too but ironically this post makes it sound like a sub is doing a bad thing using a dom for some sort of therapy , if it's working for you don't be put off by this post. Obviously good professional help if you are struggling would be best, but in the real world we all know that's not going to happen for a variety of reasons alot of the time.

[ge****]

*Checks what he would have written (albeit not so eloquently) if he were the OP here - Nods in agreement*

Spot on CK as usual - coming at this from the male submissive side I also find the "therapy" thing is not something I have encountered with any female dominants I know.

A slight counter to your OP though - I have come across *some* submissives who do use their submission as a form of therapy - however that's because they have the strength and knowledge to have chosen to for themselves not because it's been thrust upon them.

[Mz****]

I didn't see the original post either, so can't speak to that, but, as gemini man says, I know people who have used or do use their kink to help maintain their mental health, call it therapy, or call it something else, it doesn't really matter if it helps..but on their terms, at their instigation and for their benefit. I don't know a single one for whom "therapy" is the driving *** behind their kink or lifestyle.

There was a time in the 80s when if I hadn't found kink and didn't have that outlet I likely wouldn't be here, I worked in mental health, I witnessed the judgement passed down onto kinksters, there was no way in hell I was speaking to a professional, even colleagues..Fortunately things have changed for the better, therapists and counsellors are more open minded, less judgemental and less preachy..but kink friendly one's are still almost as rare as unicorn shite and access to any can be a very long wait, so it's easy to see why some, on either side of the slash may unwittingly treat their partners or playmates as substitutes for that, but thats happening as part of a trusted dynamic, for anyone to come along and declare someone they don't know as broken and that they need fixing, or, one of my personal bugbears, someone needs breaking so they can be fixed..simply wrong on every level.

 

 

[Deleted Member]

As a rider to this, and I hope @CopperKnob doesn't mind, there is a lovely lady on Fetlife under the name of TheKinkShrink who is a specialist in dealing/helping with kink-related trauma (and trauma in general) so if you feel you may need to talk with someone she is a good start.

[Deleted Member]

By writing that a D/s equals therapy, you are putting on far too large pants. A bad way to jack yourself up when you've got nothing else to impress. As usual, excellently expressed Copper.

[Deleted Member]

I take your points Copper. But do we really need to start writing posts to counter what someone else has written? It feels very negative and weighty and Im finding it hard to want to be here anymore.

[Deleted Member]

And fwiw for some people d/s IS the***utic.

[Deleted Member]

8 minutes ago, Dragonflylover said:

I take your points Copper. But do we really need to start writing posts to counter what someone else has written? It feels very negative and weighty and Im finding it hard to want to be here anymore.

Look at it on the bright side. She points out potential risks and dangers to the novice. She takes on the mentor role, as it were, voluntarily. I, and many with me, will applaud this. Safety first...

[Deleted Member]

10 minutes ago, Dragonflylover said:

And fwiw for some people d/s IS the***utic.

Note that something "can" work on someone as therapy doesn't mean you have to sell/advertise it as therapy.

[CopperKnob]

50 minutes ago, Dragonflylover said:

And fwiw for some people d/s IS the***utic.

Therapuetic is NOT the same as Therapy
D/s is NOT CBT, DBT, EMDR etc etc
It takes between 3-6yrs to train as a therapist i very much doubt there are many Doms here who've undergone any such training.
It is weighty because its a weighty subject, to suggest that those without any training can offer D/s as a therapy is extremely dangerous

[CopperKnob]

1 hour ago, MzJax said:

I didn't see the original post either, so can't speak to that, but, as gemini man says, I know people who have used or do use their kink to help maintain their mental health, call it therapy, or call it something else, it doesn't really matter if it helps..but on their terms, at their instigation and for their benefit. I don't know a single one for whom "therapy" is the driving *** behind their kink or lifestyle.

There was a time in the 80s when if I hadn't found kink and didn't have that outlet I likely wouldn't be here, I worked in mental health, I witnessed the judgement passed down onto kinksters, there was no way in hell I was speaking to a professional, even colleagues..Fortunately things have changed for the better, therapists and counsellors are more open minded, less judgemental and less preachy..but kink friendly one's are still almost as rare as unicorn shite and access to any can be a very long wait, so it's easy to see why some, on either side of the slash may unwittingly treat their partners or playmates as substitutes for that, but thats happening as part of a trusted dynamic, for anyone to come along and declare someone they don't know as broken and that they need fixing, or, one of my personal bugbears, someone needs breaking so they can be fixed..simply wrong on every level.

 

 

It matters to newbies what its called because the assumption is that those types writing the original post on a forum are experienced. All it takes is a few newbies to believe it/repeat it and it becomes dangerous. It has the potential to lead to manipulation and coerecion, the idea that the Dom is the all knowing part of the dynamic is not correct or appropriate

[Mz****]

2 minutes ago, CopperKnob said:

It matters to newbies what its called because the assumption is that those types writing the original post on a forum are experienced. All it takes is a few newbies to believe it/repeat it and it becomes dangerous. It has the potential to lead to manipulation and coerecion, the idea that the Dom is the all knowing part of the dynamic is not correct or appropriate

After reading the post you refer to, I understand your outrage towards his point of view. You have a strong opinion you are absolutely entitled to..and which in most part I agree with..and I'd absolutely recommend anyone with serious mental health issues seek professional advice and support and not try to self medicate with kink, alcohol, *** or anything else..but I wonder who declared you the voice of the people that no one is allowed to have an different idea or perspective without being spoken to like a piece of shit on the bottom of your shoe? 

[CopperKnob]

23 minutes ago, MzJax said:

After reading the post you refer to, I understand your outrage towards his point of view. You have a strong opinion you are absolutely entitled to..and which in most part I agree with..and I'd absolutely recommend anyone with serious mental health issues seek professional advice and support and not try to self medicate with kink, alcohol, *** or anything else..but I wonder who declared you the voice of the people that no one is allowed to have an different idea or perspective without being spoken to like a piece of shit on the bottom of your shoe? 

I hadn't realised I had, perhaps its more, my no fucks given attutude but, If anyones view is that D/s is an appropriate form of therapy and not at all dangerous then yeah, they can wear the title 'shit on my shoe' with pride.
What makes me the person who raises their voice above the pa***t in relation to this subject specifically is the fact that I, like you, have worked in mental health services and have seen first hand the damage that both trauma and improper use of therapy does to people. It takes years to resolve and in some cases never does

[Ch****]

As the aforementioned "unicorn shite", let me represent other pieces of unicorn shite to say that while BDSM may feel the***utic, it is definitely not therapy. Nor would any therapist with healthy boundaries attempt to practice it as such. In a BDSM relationship or play, I would not even WANT to offer interpretation or diagnosis about past conflicts, etc. If anything, I might use my guesses toward fruitful communication. It is possible to create more harm than good with such interpretations, and even in therapy such things are not used without a lot of caution and confidence, usually after a lot of time. I would agree with CK that those that easily offer interpretation under the guise of knowledge be taken with a whole shaker of salt.

Let me add that I am not making any implication toward the "alphasub" post or its author.

Edited October 23, 2021 by ChromeDom

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, MzJax said:

After reading the post you refer to, I understand your outrage towards his point of view. You have a strong opinion you are absolutely entitled to..and which in most part I agree with..and I'd absolutely recommend anyone with serious mental health issues seek professional advice and support and not try to self medicate with kink, alcohol, *** or anything else..but I wonder who declared you the voice of the people that no one is allowed to have an different idea or perspective without being spoken to like a piece of shit on the bottom of your shoe? 

Two things stand out. First, you agree with Copper. This is relevant. Second. You object that Copper, quite rightly, voluntarily assumes the responsibility of disclosing to members the inaccuracy of this article, and pointing it out to other members for security reasons. The site states that they are not responsible for the correctness of the article posted by members in the forum, and that the author of the article is responsible for this. In BDSM it is customary for each individual member to take responsibility for overall safety. Copper has taken its responsibility with this OP, warning other members about the incorrect information in an article. A concerned member of the community would support her in this, especially if he indicates that he agrees. What Copper has done is mentoring, a sacred good that contributes to safety.

[ey****]

I often think Mental Health, Kink, Therapy, so on

It's a bit of a tangled web where I want to neither invalidate experiences nor give bad advice.

Kink can be the***utic, can help with mental health, can be beneficial.
But isn't therapy.

However, of course, the mental health system, certainly in the UK, certainly needs more resources - and sometimes it's no wonder folk seek other activities.

But of course there's things to remember the leaning on kink for support is only as effective as it's availability - and - this is something where other folk may need to tred responsibly

Because if you knowingly enter a relationship with someone who is using this as support; then it can create a toxic codependency - and - I think there's nothing wrong with wanting to help/support someone else's MH - except, that, as long as that is not just being with you 

Sometimes I feel there are people who enter kink with the assumption there are "broken" people they can manipulate (oh, I mean "help") and that is something to always be wary on.

[Deleted Member]

3 hours ago, CopperKnob said:

Therapuetic is NOT the same as Therapy
D/s is NOT CBT, DBT, EMDR etc etc
It takes between 3-6yrs to train as a therapist i very much doubt there are many Doms here who've undergone any such training.
It is weighty because its a weighty subject, to suggest that those without any training can offer D/s as a therapy is extremely dangerous

Where in his post did he say d/s equals therapy. Could you quote please as I cannot see it. Also don't need you to womansplain the difference between therapy and the***utic or lecture me on anything else.

[Deleted Member]

4 hours ago, FreeUrMind said:

By writing that a D/s equals therapy, you are putting on far too large pants. A bad way to jack yourself up when you've got nothing else to impress. As usual, excellently expressed Copper.

Where did he say that. Quote from the post please.

[Ae****]

I think discussion of psychology on a site like this is a discussion between people about a topic that is immensely complex and requires experts.
So hearing people saying it is, or isn't the***utic, and giving reasons why is, in my view, people rationalising and giving opinions 🤷🏻‍♂️
I didn't see the original post, but there's no mention of how being a dom is the***utic for the dom in this one...
... And I think, in fact, that it's easy to make an argument that doms are looking to soothe personal wounds 🤫 Don't tell anyone!!!... Buuuut... Why the intense hunger for power over another? Hmmmm why indeed 🤔🤔😋😭😂