Ghosting - Let’s be Open and Honest Instead

[Be****]

I agree that there is a misunderstanding about ghosting.

Writing or replying to someone late is not ghosting.
Disappearing from a conversation for no reason and not replying (i.e., without blocking, etc) in my perception is ghosting.

[ce****]

9 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

the big problem is most of what gets called "ghosting" 

like, go on your inbox on any social network site and scroll through messages - if there's any where the other person sent the last message and you've not responded - are you ghosting?  and what about the other way?

and of course not. that's absurd. 

So I think for the purposes of this thread it might have been useful to define ghosting which is the practice of ending personal relationships by stopping all communication suddenly and without warning.
Personal relationship can of course be defined in a few ways but I wouldn’t class chatting on a forum as such- would you? To me, if your chat has reached a level where you have taken it off platform (to personal messaging) and/or had or arranged a meeting in person then this could be classed as at least the start of a personal relationship.
Copperknob mentioned personal safety and again, I don’t think cutting someone off because you feel unsafe is quite the same as what is meant by ghosting. I’d assume that if for some reason someone was making you feel unsafe you can simply send your final message and block them. Same end result but very different intention, ghosting is specifically a means of getting out of ending a relationship in an adult manner.

[sm****]

10 hours ago, centralpark said:

I’m really surprised ghosting happens in this community. It’s so immature and spineless as well as being very rude.

Sad fact we are no different to any other faccet of society.  In truth with the initial contact medium being online, makes it far to easy to treat contacts this way.  I know due to the nature of this lifestyle we put a large emphasis on trust and open communication.   Sadly this is a false pedestal we have made for ourselves.   We have just as many users etc as other parts of society,  if not attracting more due to the faceless nature of initial contacting.  Its far to easy to be disrespectful online than a real life situation and people take the cowards way out.

[ey****]

11 hours ago, centralpark said:

So I think for the purposes of this thread it might have been useful to define ghosting which is the practice of ending personal relationships by stopping all communication suddenly and without warning.
Personal relationship can of course be defined in a few ways but I wouldn’t class chatting on a forum as such- would you? To me, if your chat has reached a level where you have taken it off platform (to personal messaging) and/or had or arranged a meeting in person then this could be classed as at least the start of a personal relationship.

yep - I agree.

and while ghosting does happen in the community, to this level, it's actually more likely to be women ghosted then men - but men complain loudest

their view of ghosting is "we were chatting and it was going well and then she stopped" (with no metrics on it going well, other than they thought it was.  potentially assumptions about how two-way this was) 

[ce****]

16 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

yep - I agree.

and while ghosting does happen in the community, to this level, it's actually more likely to be women ghosted then men - but men complain loudest

their view of ghosting is "we were chatting and it was going well and then she stopped" (with no metrics on it going well, other than they thought it was.  potentially assumptions about how two-way this was) 

You make a good point here. I am constantly amazed by how many men don’t listen at all. They see your pictures and create a fantasy version of you and won’t hear different. I’ve literally spelled out so plainly to people - “that’s not who/what I am, that is the opposite of what I’m looking for, I’m not at all interested in that” etc and they just bulldoze ahead regardless! So it doesn’t surprise me that guys would miss signals that a chat isn’t going anywhere though to be fair on here you can just send a no thanks message and that ought to let them know in plain terms how you’re feeling

[ey****]

6 hours ago, centralpark said:

You make a good point here. I am constantly amazed by how many men don’t listen at all. They see your pictures and create a fantasy version of you and won’t hear different. I’ve literally spelled out so plainly to people - “that’s not who/what I am, that is the opposite of what I’m looking for, I’m not at all interested in that” etc and they just bulldoze ahead regardless! So it doesn’t surprise me that guys would miss signals that a chat isn’t going anywhere though to be fair on here you can just send a no thanks message and that ought to let them know in plain terms how you’re feeling

I think - oooh

there's a couple of bits where, guys can make assumptions on familiarity. I have done it in the past, I may well do it in the future.  I've seen others do it.  I remember one guy wrote on a forum thread "ooh, ______ is here, we're friends, hiiii" to which the lady replied, "I'm sorry - but - we met once, you seemed OK, we're not friends - we're people who met"  ouch.  

And it can be exciting messaging back and forth wondering if you'll meet, where things will go - etc - and the other person may very well enjoy chatting, but not feel that way - especially if they were approached under a guise of friendship, or mentorship or whatever.

 

[ce****]

19 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I think - oooh

there's a couple of bits where, guys can make assumptions on familiarity. I have done it in the past, I may well do it in the future.  I've seen others do it.  I remember one guy wrote on a forum thread "ooh, ______ is here, we're friends, hiiii" to which the lady replied, "I'm sorry - but - we met once, you seemed OK, we're not friends - we're people who met"  ouch.  

And it can be exciting messaging back and forth wondering if you'll meet, where things will go - etc - and the other person may very well enjoy chatting, but not feel that way - especially if they were approached under a guise of friendship, or mentorship or whatever.

 

Oh wow that seems quite harsh from the lady in the forum thread ha 😆 I’m a softy so I’d definitely be more delicate than that (and then probably complain bitterly when my subtlety isn’t understood 😂)

[ey****]

7 hours ago, centralpark said:

Oh wow that seems quite harsh from the lady in the forum thread ha 😆 I’m a softy so I’d definitely be more delicate than that (and then probably complain bitterly when my subtlety isn’t understood 😂)

I think it possibly did come across harsh, but in context I understand

I guess another example.   There's a lady who I filmed with a couple of years ago - and to help out with costs and convenience she suggested coming down the night before and sleeping in her spare room - she also invited my wife as part of this.  Cooked breakfast, looked after us and we had a great time.

But we'd been chatting the evening before and she said a problem she'd had with a lot of guys, again, the assume familiarity.  She said she would say to them "I am friendly, I am not your friend" and some might have a lip quiver - but it can be a case of "OK, when is my my birthday?", "When did we last go to the pub or dinner?", "Outside of kink, when did we talk about anything other than basic small talk?" 

And it gave me a lot to think about. I've never forgot that conversation.  Cos I'd hazard to bet that again, most guys complaining about conversation break down - most of these conversations will have been kink and small talk.  

[Ar****]

9 hours ago, centralpark said:

Oh wow that seems quite harsh from the lady in the forum thread ha 😆 I’m a softy so I’d definitely be more delicate than that (and then probably complain bitterly when my subtlety isn’t understood 😂)

How would you have phrased it more delicately? This isn't intended confrontationally, I'm genuinely curious and interested.

I personally don't think there was anything harsh in the comment at all; people using others they've met once as a means to get rubber-stamped as okay/safe seems really dodgy to me. It might have been meant innocently but some people will take advantage and the way I see it she needed to be assertive in disassociating herself so that it was clear he wasn't going to be able to use her as a character reference.

I'd probably have said something similar, I'm always interested in learning to be more diplomatic if I'm going too far though.

[ce****]

14 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I think it possibly did come across harsh, but in context I understand

I guess another example.   There's a lady who I filmed with a couple of years ago - and to help out with costs and convenience she suggested coming down the night before and sleeping in her spare room - she also invited my wife as part of this.  Cooked breakfast, looked after us and we had a great time.

But we'd been chatting the evening before and she said a problem she'd had with a lot of guys, again, the assume familiarity.  She said she would say to them "I am friendly, I am not your friend" and some might have a lip quiver - but it can be a case of "OK, when is my my birthday?", "When did we last go to the pub or dinner?", "Outside of kink, when did we talk about anything other than basic small talk?" 

And it gave me a lot to think about. I've never forgot that conversation.  Cos I'd hazard to bet that again, most guys complaining about conversation break down - most of these conversations will have been kink and small talk.  

Yep I said this to someone I’ve been chatting to yesterday. They were thinking of leaving the site, frustrated with convos that were going nowhere. I suggested they try challenging the ladies they’re chatting to (not confrontation, I mean intellectually, emotionally or just thinking outside the box)
Literally no one likes small talk but conversation and communication is a lost art

[CopperKnob]

13 hours ago, Aranhis said:

How would you have phrased it more delicately? This isn't intended confrontationally, I'm genuinely curious and interested.

I personally don't think there was anything harsh in the comment at all; people using others they've met once as a means to get rubber-stamped as okay/safe seems really dodgy to me. It might have been meant innocently but some people will take advantage and the way I see it she needed to be assertive in disassociating herself so that it was clear he wasn't going to be able to use her as a character reference.

I'd probably have said something similar, I'm always interested in learning to be more diplomatic if I'm going too far though.

For me, sometimes being clear is being kind. Making people play guessing games isn't.
I was out last night and someone I don't know offered me a drink which I declined. He came back with a soft drink which he gave me two options, accept it or leave it and walk away.
The first teaches him that persistence pays off when someone says no. The latter makes me look rude. I'd rather be rude and safe than unclear/send mixed messages.
I saw nothing wrong with how the individual handled the situation in Eyems first example.

NB before anyone says it, ghosting is a clear signal.

[ey****]

5 hours ago, centralpark said:

Literally no one likes small talk but conversation and communication is a lost art

it's funny in a kinda way that - it's often underestimated how difficult comms from cold is.  "Hello, How are you? hows your day been" and then actually not knowing where to go from there "I wanna be your sub/Dom partner" is too fast/forward at that stage, "So what you here for?" when it's clear on the profile - or - so on.

And for all the years of sites like this, no one actually got all that better at it.   

[ce****]

4 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

it's funny in a kinda way that - it's often underestimated how difficult comms from cold is.  "Hello, How are you? hows your day been" and then actually not knowing where to go from there "I wanna be your sub/Dom partner" is too fast/forward at that stage, "So what you here for?" when it's clear on the profile - or - so on.

And for all the years of sites like this, no one actually got all that better at it.   

I think humour is the way forward but sometimes people don’t get it which is always quite entertaining. I mean I’m no expert, I just suggested marriage as an opener on Tinder 🤣🤣🤣

[Du****]

16 hours ago, centralpark said:

I think humour is the way forward but sometimes people don’t get it which is always quite entertaining. I mean I’m no expert, I just suggested marriage as an opener on Tinder 🤣🤣🤣

I agree, humour is charming, and even if not successful every time, it’s less likely to cause offence. ‘Forward but cute’ is magnitudes more acceptable than ‘forward and obscene’. Granted, we all have different opinions about what’s ‘cute’ - I’ve had both of these today:
.
“So I’m thinking we name our future cats Muffin and Peach to remind me what I first noticed about you”
.
“Hey! 😜 I know you said not to say hey but that’s just me”
.
The first is quite ridiculous and impertinent, but rather adorable. That’s a conversation that is likely to continue. The second will get an eyeroll and a block, because deliberately doing a thing I’ve asked to avoid is just rude.

[Di****]

It costs nothing to be kind. Just be honest.

[2b****]

Agreed, I don’t understand why we all have to act better the the next, sorry in my opinion we all bleed the and for the most part we all breed the same so get off your high horse and be nice for once!!

[Ae****]

15 hours ago, DirtyBlondeMuse said:

It costs nothing to be kind. Just be honest.

Some people who receive messages think senders have a monopoly on a lack of social skill, smoothness, rudeness or embarrassing themselves.

They are oblivious to the notion that their reaction is revealing. That reaction, internally and in their actual response, including their view of senders and the rationalising as to why they can and should think of and treat them the way that they consequently do - that reaction they have speaks volumes of their character, understanding and overall level of maturity.

The same way we look down on some people for their ways of interacting - we may have the humility to think there are people looking at our reaction to them in that situation and feeling 2nd hand embarrassment, because maybe we are also showing impressive levels of social ineptitude.

[ey****]

19 hours ago, DirtyBlondeMuse said:

It costs nothing to be kind. Just be honest.

not entirely true

kindness has a high cost.  It has emotional labour.  It has the cost of time. 

And it goes back really to why the person didn't respond anyway.  90%+ of what gets called "ghosting" actually isn't.    It's often just conversation that's fizzled out.   Or when the other person has made a deliberate decision not to respond it's more likely to be for red flag behaviour, and wording a nicey nice reply to someone who is being intrusive, dangerous or of concern carries a massive cost.

[Co****]

I assume that the reason most people take to ghosting someone is that they are afraid that they will receive an angry response or an argument if they simply say “I’m just not interested.” I think for the most part these ***s are unwarranted. I would appreciate being told that someone is “moving on” rather than having to wonder if something happened or if they might be waiting for something from me.

[Be****]

@ColoShark in my perspective and as i experienced it is not that way. Some of people who i know in real life made some ghosting to others while i was near. And when i ask why they did that their answer was like cba. Therefore hoping the best is generally naive.

[Bu****]

Id just like a response. I say hi and then nothing. A no thank you or not interested would be a step up...

[Se****]

Don’t ghost, it’s a really rubbish thing to do to someone. Just be polite say not interested anymore. In a kink dynamic/relationship communication is vital… so then you just this someone?!?!?!

[ey****]

3 hours ago, Sebille said:

In a kink dynamic/relationship communication is vital… so then you just this someone?!?!?!

there is two, or arguably three, takeaways to take from this

1) two people just exchanging messages are not in a dynamic.  if someone ends a conversation by choice then it is a sign they do not wish to be in a dynamic

2) given the importance of communication if someone does do this poorly by deliberately ghosting - then the other person dodged a bullet

3) communication is also a two way process - if someone has deliberately stopped responding it can very well be down to the senders poor communication - or if it's just a genuine conversation fizzle - then the person complaining about being ghosted can reignite at any time.

 

anecdotally - this week on another site I started getting messages from a guy who wanted to get into filming.  I know him personally (though he's not a friend) and he is woefully unsuitable for filming. There are a list of reasons why he is unsuitable.  But he messaged and that arguably the right thing to do was to not respond.   But I responded, stating no there was nothing I could offer him right now.  And every point I made he argued.  He'd mentioned he'd been in ill health, well I'm sorry to hear that - but absolutely we need people who are fully/mostly fit - he argued he "was fine" I again cycled back that regardless of if he was a professional athlete with a body of Adonis I still had nothing to offer.

Eventually, for my sanity, there is only one thing I could do.  Stop responding.  Which is 'ghosting', apparently.  

[Th****]

On 3/14/2024 at 6:38 PM, ColoShark said:

I assume that the reason most people take to ghosting someone is that they are afraid that they will receive an angry response or an argument if they simply say “I’m just not interested.” I think for the most part these ***s are unwarranted. I would appreciate being told that someone is “moving on” rather than having to wonder if something happened or if they might be waiting for something from me.

You would be very incorrect about the "unwarranted" part. 

[Th****]

I'm not going to go back and read all of the more recent comments here but will add something as I've been experiencing a fair amount of it recently. 

A lot of men probably think they're being "ghosted" because they approach someone and initiate contact then put in little to no effort to be engaging. I'm not going to do the work and entertain someone who is behaving like all they need to do is show up and have someone falling all over them. Or show up then pass along the responsibility of keeping things going to the other person. 

 

There also have been more than a few incidents where messages on this site don't go through. I even made a post about it in the SOS Technical issues section of the forums 

Edited March 19 by ThaliaV